Please help to to get more distance

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Please help to to get more distance

Postby Lezard » Sun Dec 21, 2008 8:06 am

Hi,just found this site...Wow,it´s great.

I practiced alot last year and allready got more distance than before,but now I stopped improving for months.
Where I come from I can´t ask anyone for advice,we´re not many and no one here has a big arm.

http://de.youtube.com/watch?v=jPON9c6_SPY

1st Disc is a 175g new Star Destroyer
2nd is a 173 slightly beat Star Destroyer
3rd is a 173 new Champion Boss
4th is the first one again
All thrown pretty flat.

I hope you can help me.
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Re: Please help to to get more distance

Postby PRES 10 » Sun Dec 21, 2008 10:49 am

form looks pretty decent what kind of distance are yo getting 400ish? it looks like the disc is coming out kinda slow, you might need to change your grip up too get a little more snap. Also the run-up is a little excessive. But overall form looks pretty good.
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Re: Please help to to get more distance

Postby Lezard » Sun Dec 21, 2008 11:48 am

Distance varies alot,mostly I get about 420-430,sometimes I get 460 and don´t know why,that bothors me alot,I know I can get more distance,but now how.
My run-up is new,i changed it 2 months ago form a trditional x-step,so I´m a bit unstable with it at the moment,but i feel more comfortable with it.

Thanks for helping,hope to get some more deteils =)
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Re: Please help to to get more distance

Postby black udder » Sun Dec 21, 2008 1:53 pm

You might get a little more distance with some lighter discs - 169g range and putting some hyzer on the release. That might get you a little more play and get you over the disc more.

I don't know what you're getting out of the run up (in added distance) but it seems to be more than you should need. The momentum you're building isn't going into your throw. If you watch some of the longer throwers, they spin and eject the disc and they stay almost in place. You continue past your lie because of your momentum. To me, it would imply a lot of upper body rotation that's pulling you forward instead of planting and starting with lower body rotation which should keep you in place.

I'd guess that you're longer throws are because you get your shoulder squared up more than other times. Probably just a timing thing and sometimes you hit it, but most of the time you just miss it. I can only guess that it's probably a small window that you've got to hit, so practice might help but it might be that it's something only the best are able to do consistently.

Looks like you're getting a tight pull and some weight forwards. I think you could use more weight forward, but, to be honest, it's too close for me to be sure about it. The form looks good, but I'd hope that Blake comments since this is the area where his tips can really help.
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Re: Please help to to get more distance

Postby Lezard » Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:49 pm

Thanks for your analysis Black udder,can´t wait to start training,seems like I need to change more than I though..
Well,at least I have goal now =)
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Re: Please help to to get more distance

Postby masterbeato » Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:51 pm

Lezard wrote:I know I can get more distance,but now how.



Accelerate more:

Practice starting your pull slower, and at the end "hit" it as hard as you can.

You are almost there!

Your almost to the point where you can "hit" it.
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Re: Please help to to get more distance

Postby JR » Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:56 pm

Hallo und willkommen. Ich weiss nicht wenn du ein deutcher bist oder nicht und weil mein Deutsch nicht so gut ist werde ich die technische sachen auf English schreiben. Kansst du fahren nach süd Deutschland? Ich glaube Chris Voigt wohnt in München und Michael Stelzer spielt wo sie haben die Europa meisterschaften gehabt. Sie können weit schmeissen. Vielleicht rehder hier kann erzählen wie du kannst der däne Karl Johan Höj Nybo sehen auch. Natürlich gibt es weitschmeisser auch in Schweden und Finnland aber es wird ein bischen länger zu fahren.

You could use a slightly lower stance maybe 5-10 cm so bending more at the knees should help you push harder and accelerate longer with the legs. Definitely getting more weight forward that is heart over the right knee at the release will help. Otherwise all I can see is slight lack of explosiveness in speed of motions and too early beginnings of quick acceleration. Unless the couple of centimeters you could bring the disc closer to the chest harm you but you need summer to take off the vest anyway :-) Can't be 100 % certain but you seem to bend your wrist backwards in the reach back but I think it's straight at the chest area so it probably won't hurt you.

Have you tried throwing at higher level than about nipple height? Dave Dunipace recommends shoulder height. This is a bit contrary to how muscles generate most power when they're at the center of their moving range like Chris Voigt has said in an interview that I don't remember the source of. Too bad the search function is not that great at the moment because it was posted on this board.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: Please help to to get more distance

Postby Lezard » Sun Dec 21, 2008 3:23 pm

Yes,I´m german.
I see Michael and Nybo every Year at the Berlin open.
Next year I want to play most of the german tour,so I will most prolly see them again.

Thanks for all the help,I hope I can add this to my throw.
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Re: Please help to to get more distance

Postby black udder » Sun Dec 21, 2008 4:08 pm

masterbeato wrote:
Lezard wrote:I know I can get more distance,but now how.



Accelerate more:

Practice starting your pull slower, and at the end "hit" it as hard as you can.

You are almost there!

Your almost to the point where you can "hit" it.


If MB is talking about late acceleration, I believe that it's easier if you keep your arm back as you rotate your hips, then torso. When your arm is pulled through rotation to around the chest area, then you pull fast, it's a shorter and later distance to pull. It might throw off your timing, but I think it helps understand the "pull late" or "accelerate late" concept.
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Re: Please help to to get more distance

Postby Bradley Walker » Sun Dec 21, 2008 5:40 pm

masterbeato wrote:
Lezard wrote:I know I can get more distance,but now how.



Accelerate more:

Practice starting your pull slower, and at the end "hit" it as hard as you can.

You are almost there!

Your almost to the point where you can "hit" it.


I agree.

You are throwing 100% into the hit and about 70% out of the hit. It should be the other way around.

The disc is trapped behind your left pec/the elbow is never getting fully set into the right pec. Thus you are actually throwing what I call "crooked arm", as the elbow is never really getting bent enough to be "bent elbow".

You have a strong pull but average acceleration due to the above items.

Both of these are discussed in the MasterBeatO video.
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Re: Please help to to get more distance

Postby Lezard » Mon Dec 22, 2008 2:53 am

Thanks alot for all the help,seems like alot to work on,at least I still have a few months for practice =)
Can´t wait to get started after christmas.

Marry christmas.
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Re: Please help to to get more distance

Postby JR » Mon Dec 22, 2008 6:38 am

Beautiful park course at the BO.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: Please help to to get more distance

Postby Lezard » Tue Dec 23, 2008 12:45 pm

I watched Masterbeato´s video (great video,I wish I could have seen it years ago),it was a great help to understand the posts since my english is a little weak,after seeing it I know what to do.
Yesterday I even tried it,I did about 100 drives and was pretty happy with the result,no distance improvement yet and I´m a bit off balance with all the new stuff, but it feels like it will work in the end.
I´ll send another Video as soon as I feel confident with the new movings.

JR wrote:Beautiful park course at the BO.

I like it,too,I just love our "valley of tears" and "rodelbahn" hole.
Too bad it´s no permanent course,would like to play it more often.
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Re: Please help to to get more distance

Postby presidio hills » Tue Dec 23, 2008 10:18 pm

Bradley Walker wrote:The disc is trapped behind your left pec/the elbow is never getting fully set into the right pec. Thus you are actually throwing what I call "crooked arm", as the elbow is never really getting bent enough to be "bent elbow".

You have a strong pull but average acceleration due to the above items.

Both of these are discussed in the MasterBeatO video.


bradley are you referring to pointing the elbow at the target during the pull? i just want to clarify for myself...
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Re: Please help to to get more distance

Postby Bradley Walker » Wed Dec 24, 2008 8:53 am

Watch the Beat vid. Pay attention to the part where he explains adding pull to the pec drill.

The pull should only serve to cock the elbow angle.

If you look the forearm will remain pointed at the target for the entire pull as the elbow cocks. Then it will release in a split second, this creating TRUE acceleration.

This guy using his pull to throw the disc, not to cock the elbow, so it is constant speed.
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