OK, my turn...

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Re: OK, my turn...

Postby black udder » Thu Feb 05, 2009 10:34 am

malinkie wrote:
roman wrote:Looks like you have the same problem I do - following through on a downward plane... Do you have any problems with discs burning left for you?


Luckily no. I only really do that with putters n mids. I come straight across with drivers. I probably shouldn't be changing my plane per disc :roll:

black udder wrote:Looks like some OAT. You're not getting your weight forward. You're off center of your axis.


OAT does not show itsself in the disc flight... How do i get back to my center axis?

I have been having issues getting the whip like manner my from the hips up. I do feel like i get no power from my body apart from from my arms. Is the only way to work on this to throw stationary?

Looks like i have plenty to work on for this year :)


The OAT is keeping discs flat or making them float left. Watch when you throw, you come through at around nipple level, but finish below that. You don't follow through correctly. You pull your arm down and inside after your throw. You should try keeping the same trajectory with your arm and rotate your shoulders. It'll open up your shoulder some. Then, when your arm reaches it's maximum flexibility, it should come down.

When you throw, you are basically spinning in place and the disc is pulled from one side and shot (thrown) out the other. Imagine your spine as a pole in the ground and don't rotate off that pole. If you watch your video, you'll see you are rotating off that axis. You're also pulling from your reachback all the way through to the release. You should be letting your hip and body rotation pull your arm part of the way so you when you do pull, you start later and at the hit, you are pulling as fast as you can. By the time you get to the rip point, you've already been pulling all across your body and out the other side. A late pull doesn't start until the disc is close to the center of your chest, then you accelerate up to just beyond the hit.
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Re: OK, my turn...

Postby malinkie » Thu Feb 05, 2009 12:58 pm

Jesse B 707 wrote:A lefty whos home course is AP....... rough, that front nine must be a bit rough from time to time


Yeah but i can throw just as well forehand. We should maybe hookup sometime :)

black udder wrote:The OAT is keeping discs flat or making them float left. Watch when you throw, you come through at around nipple level, but finish below that. You don't follow through correctly. You pull your arm down and inside after your throw. You should try keeping the same trajectory with your arm and rotate your shoulders. It'll open up your shoulder some. Then, when your arm reaches it's maximum flexibility, it should come down.

When you throw, you are basically spinning in place and the disc is pulled from one side and shot (thrown) out the other. Imagine your spine as a pole in the ground and don't rotate off that pole. If you watch your video, you'll see you are rotating off that axis. You're also pulling from your reachback all the way through to the release. You should be letting your hip and body rotation pull your arm part of the way so you when you do pull, you start later and at the hit, you are pulling as fast as you can. By the time you get to the rip point, you've already been pulling all across your body and out the other side. A late pull doesn't start until the disc is close to the center of your chest, then you accelerate up to just beyond the hit.


I understand now how the OAT was coming into effect. Here is another question... I have noticed that by slightly dropping my shoulder during reach back, it keeps my pull through at the correct level and also helps with nose down and getting my weight forward. Is this correct posture or am I giving myself more bad habits?
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Re: OK, my turn...

Postby black udder » Thu Feb 05, 2009 1:52 pm

Dropping your shoulder is an option. I believe MB dips his shoulder as well. You would only need to do that for a full reach back though. Also, you need to make sure that you're smooth coming through. I don't think that dropping your shoulder by itself means that you're doing anything other than dropping your shoulder and the benefits you see (i.e. more nose down). You'll be getting your weight forward when you push your weight onto your plant foot.
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Re: OK, my turn...

Postby noah » Fri Feb 06, 2009 8:34 am

mark12b wrote:that's a reference to this tip from barry schultz

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XkOE6TAMrY4


I can't see the difference. One thing I've noticed is that i'm starting to see the difference in throws that before I couldn't. I suppose it's like learning a language.

1. You don't see what you're doing wrong.
2. You can hear/tell you're doing something wrong.
3. You fix it.


Is his arm out to far from his body when he throws?
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Re: OK, my turn...

Postby mark12b » Fri Feb 06, 2009 10:19 am

noah wrote:
mark12b wrote:that's a reference to this tip from barry schultz

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XkOE6TAMrY4


I can't see the difference. One thing I've noticed is that i'm starting to see the difference in throws that before I couldn't. I suppose it's like learning a language.

1. You don't see what you're doing wrong.
2. You can hear/tell you're doing something wrong.
3. You fix it.

Is his arm out to far from his body when he throws?


the barry schultz thing is all about the smoothness -- the other aspects of his technique are somewhat different than the advice you get here on dgr. iirc blake has said that barry's a great player but his overall form is not something to try to emulate.
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Re: OK, my turn...

Postby noah » Fri Feb 06, 2009 10:22 am

mark12b wrote:
noah wrote:
mark12b wrote:that's a reference to this tip from barry schultz

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XkOE6TAMrY4


I can't see the difference. One thing I've noticed is that i'm starting to see the difference in throws that before I couldn't. I suppose it's like learning a language.

1. You don't see what you're doing wrong.
2. You can hear/tell you're doing something wrong.
3. You fix it.

Is his arm out to far from his body when he throws?


the barry schultz thing is all about the smoothness -- the other aspects of his technique are somewhat different than the advice you get here on dgr. iirc blake has said that barry's a great player but his overall form is not something to try to emulate.


I don't even see the difference in smoothness. I went and looked at my old disc golf tapes of my self, I can't tell smooth from not smooth. I'll keep looking! Thanks for clarifying on the rest of the form though.
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Re: OK, my turn...

Postby malinkie » Fri Feb 06, 2009 12:33 pm

malinkie wrote:Dropping your shoulder is an option.


:? I overemphasize the shoulder drop. Looking at it again , I actually pull the back shoulder up. That forces the throwing arms shoulder down and my upper body's weight forward. You can try this yourself. Pull back and when you at your max lift your opposite shoulder to your ear (keep it comfortable / don't push it)

You see how it naturally brings the swing plane down. This brings it to the point where i come through flat and is the natural swing plane of my arm. It also forces the hips to pop out slightly allowing for easier weight forward (stops me leaning back before my plant foot)...

This is probably bad :oops:
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Re: OK, my turn...

Postby Jesse B 707 » Fri Feb 06, 2009 1:55 pm

malinkie wrote:Yeah but i can throw just as well forehand. We should maybe hookup sometime :)

Im down, I dont make it down to AP that often though, usually if im already that far i might as well keep cruising for a while and play DeLa
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Re: OK, my turn...

Postby black udder » Fri Feb 06, 2009 2:02 pm

noah wrote:
mark12b wrote:
noah wrote:
mark12b wrote:that's a reference to this tip from barry schultz

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XkOE6TAMrY4


I can't see the difference. One thing I've noticed is that i'm starting to see the difference in throws that before I couldn't. I suppose it's like learning a language.

1. You don't see what you're doing wrong.
2. You can hear/tell you're doing something wrong.
3. You fix it.

Is his arm out to far from his body when he throws?


the barry schultz thing is all about the smoothness -- the other aspects of his technique are somewhat different than the advice you get here on dgr. iirc blake has said that barry's a great player but his overall form is not something to try to emulate.


I don't even see the difference in smoothness. I went and looked at my old disc golf tapes of my self, I can't tell smooth from not smooth. I'll keep looking! Thanks for clarifying on the rest of the form though.


If you look at the two throws, in the herky jerky one, his movements are quick and studdering or sharp. His motion looks a little out of control. In the second throw, you can see the actions are deliberate and there isn't as much motion in his throw. The point is that you can get the same distance and better accuracy by focusing on throwing properly instead of just flailing around or heaving the disc using body strength.
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Re: OK, my turn...

Postby noah » Fri Feb 06, 2009 2:13 pm

black udder wrote:
noah wrote:
mark12b wrote:
noah wrote:
mark12b wrote:that's a reference to this tip from barry schultz

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XkOE6TAMrY4


I can't see the difference. One thing I've noticed is that i'm starting to see the difference in throws that before I couldn't. I suppose it's like learning a language.

1. You don't see what you're doing wrong.
2. You can hear/tell you're doing something wrong.
3. You fix it.

Is his arm out to far from his body when he throws?


the barry schultz thing is all about the smoothness -- the other aspects of his technique are somewhat different than the advice you get here on dgr. iirc blake has said that barry's a great player but his overall form is not something to try to emulate.


I don't even see the difference in smoothness. I went and looked at my old disc golf tapes of my self, I can't tell smooth from not smooth. I'll keep looking! Thanks for clarifying on the rest of the form though.


If you look at the two throws, in the herky jerky one, his movements are quick and studdering or sharp. His motion looks a little out of control. In the second throw, you can see the actions are deliberate and there isn't as much motion in his throw. The point is that you can get the same distance and better accuracy by focusing on throwing properly instead of just flailing around or heaving the disc using body strength.


After watching this thing about 4 more times I finally see it. He is muscling the disc vs letting his body flow. I need to watch more of my own tape, I imagine I have the herky-jerkies!
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Re: OK, my turn...

Postby Blake_T » Fri Feb 27, 2009 12:27 am

problems:

1. all of your weight is leaned off to the left for almost the entirety of the throw. basically, you are in a position to throw a roller (or steep angle anhyzer) on the throws. a lot of the issues that were described would (or at least could be) fixed by this as i believe this is causing the majority of the problems.

2. wussing the hit. at the point when you should be "getting strong" it seems like your arm goes limp. basically, you are putting a lot of power getting to the power zone and then dropping off power completely. should be relaxed in the beginning and strong late.

3. any kind of knee pain is likely caused by being weight back at the pivot. your hips clear well and it's a clean pivot, but your left foot is still touching the ground when this happens. while this might be okay with a heel pivot, you are pivoting on the ball and would need your left foot off the ground to really ease this strain.
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