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Postby felixtibs » Thu Sep 18, 2008 9:07 pm

OK, I have been keeping at it and trying to incorporate all of your advice. I have another question regarding the technique black suggested.

What I am doing is in a field with a practice basket about 100' out, I stand facing perpendicular to the basket with my feet facing perpendicular as well. Its a mid-range approach stance. I have been focusing on getting straight lines and "feeling the snap" which as of now still remains fairly elusive. I start with the disc at my L shoulder and look at my arm as I pull through in a straight line as close to my chest as possible as I attempt to release in front of me in a straight line at the basket. Most shots sail over the basket but rarerly one sinks. Then I just walk over and pick them up and putt them in. Mostly I shank it to the right of the basket most times


My question is: Should my feet remain perpendicular or should I stand with my lead foot pointing towards the basket? Right now I am just arming it the 100' without any real body involvement.

Now before i began this alien series of exercises, I was tearing out my rotator cuff and launching them 300'. I must admit I am feeling disparaged with this new and difficult exercise. Knowing I was doing it right, would certainly reassure me.

Thanks again
FT[/b]
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Postby Timko » Thu Sep 18, 2008 9:56 pm

This is assuming you're tossing it 100ft, as opposed to putting/jump putting it.

Where your feet are located is irrellivent. I've seen them in different locations for differnt people. What's important is your feet allow you get rotation and weight shift, just like you do with a normal drive.

I think I throw with my left foot perpendicular, and my right foot at 40-50 from the basket. The left foot still lets me drive through, and the right foot being opened a little more seems to let me get my weight forward a little earlier in the throw, allowing me to generate some body English that will give me the flight I want.

If you're throwing it over the basket, then it sounds like you're hitting your line. If your practicing by attempting to make these shots, then a lower arm slot may be what you're looking for. Are you tossing these shots nose up or nose down?
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Postby JR » Fri Sep 19, 2008 7:19 am

In time it's possible to throw a distance driver to past 300' with arm alone both feet pointing 90 degrees left of the target. I need a bit of weight shift from left foot to right foot and full arm distance in the reach back for 300' and a good pull but it's possible.
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Postby felixtibs » Sat Sep 20, 2008 3:45 pm

Day 4 diary

I had a pretty big realization today:
1)weight shifting forward over your front foot helps transmit your energy forward and seems to decrease high shots
2)closing and opening the hips gives you a window of time to get your arm thru and snap at its apex.
3)my finger hurts from the snap

about 200' from a standstill windup with mid rangers

So far I am really happy with my progress, even though taking a step backwards is tough, my body really can relax more into this throwing style.

I even had a fluke 200' straight bullet from my QJLS, dont know where that came from!
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Postby JR » Sat Sep 20, 2008 10:30 pm

felixtibs wrote:Day 4 diary

I had a pretty big realization today:
1)weight shifting forward over your front foot helps transmit your energy forward and seems to decrease high shots
2)closing and opening the hips gives you a window of time to get your arm thru and snap at its apex.
3)my finger hurts from the snap

about 200' from a standstill windup with mid rangers

So far I am really happy with my progress, even though taking a step backwards is tough, my body really can relax more into this throwing style.

I even had a fluke 200' straight bullet from my QJLS, dont know where that came from!


Glad you're liking the results :-) If I had to guess that QJLS shot was thanks to snap. It doesn't require mega snap or huge distance to make easier discs fly straight and QJLS is one of those. It sounds like you found your straigh shot disc.
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Postby felixtibs » Sun Sep 21, 2008 5:48 pm

So today was fun, I added the X step to the upper body stand still shot

Much straighter shots, much more spin and snap and still same distance as I was throwing before i reassessed and "started from the ground up".

NOt that I am consistent and accurate, but for the first time i actually lost sight of my SL because it was so flat It got lost in the horizon! I just wanted to make sure that since I was going on a big East Coast road trip that I could still throw long when needed!

Hopefully these updates serve as inspiration for those out there struggling with their form and not knowing if they want to start from a standstill and give up their yardage.
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Postby Aaron_D » Tue Sep 23, 2008 5:33 pm

As a general rule I like to keep my feet nearly perpendicular to the basket on most approaches, unless otherwise forced to take a different stance. Since doing this I have noticed a lot more consistency in my approach game. Whatever you do, I would make sure I had a plan for my footing and that I was keeping it the same every time. I have been told by more than one really good player to keep my lead foot oriented 90 degrees, perpendicular to the target. If you dont trust your footwork nothing is going to feel consistent.
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Postby felixtibs » Wed Sep 24, 2008 8:52 pm

ok, here is week 2 update:

Standing shots up to 200' fairl reliably
Wrist roll prevention techniques have given me more stable shots
More relaxed, my arm doesnt hurt anymore
my run up shot is about the same, just with much less body damage to myself!

Now i gotta relearn how to hyzer and anhyser before I head over to Warwick for a day!
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New throws

Postby felixtibs » Thu Oct 09, 2008 4:08 pm

Here is an updated look at how my throwing has progressed:

-Much less strain on my body
-more predicatble throws
-same distance of about 300'

http://www.flickr.com/photos/felixtibs/2926997791

http://www.flickr.com/photos/felixtibs/2926944783

http://www.flickr.com/photos/felixtibs/2927040063

http://www.flickr.com/photos/felixtibs/2927922798

here is some putting:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/felixtibs/2927088303

http://www.flickr.com/photos/felixtibs/2927988808

http://www.flickr.com/photos/felixtibs/2927966712

honesty hurts, but your comments(as stated) are appreciated.
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Postby black udder » Thu Oct 09, 2008 7:04 pm

Looks pretty good. I don't see much difference between your stand still and x-step as far as form goes. Do you get much more distance? I think that the power generated by both looks about the same. I'd see what standing throwing does by itself. You can also stand on your left foot and then just plant and unwind / pull. That can generate more power without x-step.

Then, when you x-step, put more power and explosiveness into the hip rotation. It looks like you are using the hips, but not to much effect. I suspect that the shots that don't come out well are just coming out early or you're rotating your upper body too fast, so the disc comes out while it's still at your left arm instead of in front of your chest.

You're also not getting over your plant foot much. Those shots that are turning over are probably because you're so upright, you're throwing just a tad anhyzer at release. You get over on your plant foot more and you'll find more hyzer releases.

You can also improve your arm speed and rotational speed, but I'd suggest that later as you improve at lower speeds.

If you're throwing 170g discs or more, I'd back off and you'll get more glide.
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Postby felixtibs » Thu Oct 09, 2008 7:12 pm

i try and keep it below 170 if possible. Right now I am getting the best throws out of my 154g Swift Fox, however my 150 leopard is very flippy as I have said before.

I get about the same distance with the X as I am from standing, generally less anhyzer with an Xstep. Ill do a more complete analysis of the distances tomorrow, as well as try out the left--> right step. i will also focus on getting over my plant foot more to prevent than anhyzer toss, which would be huge.

As always, thank you for your input, it has helped me greatly.
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Postby Beetard » Thu Oct 09, 2008 7:13 pm

Your latest drives look 100 times better than the ones you posted in your first video. You're really getting somewhere. I'm not a good video critiquer, but here's what I think:

You're really starting to get good elbow lead, but try to make it even better. Like masterbeato has told me, "Act like you're trying to punch your elbow through a board" Pull that elbow as far as possible before your forearm comes around. The later in the throw your forearm comes around, the faster it will come around.

Get more weight forward. Plant your foot and lean over it as you rotate.

The kind of changes you have made in less than a month are great.
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Postby cmlasley » Thu Oct 09, 2008 7:15 pm

You look much more relaxed, and you are getting much better late acceleration. Like BU said, you're throwing with some anny. You can clean this up in a number of ways. I suggest making your run-up more diagonal from left to right. This will put your body in a better position to throw hyzers.

You definitely need to get your hips into it more. I'm learning this myself right now, so I don't have any advice on that.
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Postby felixtibs » Thu Oct 09, 2008 7:50 pm

well thank you so much for your kind words. I have worked hard on just relaxing and that in it self has been much more forgiving on my knee and shoulder.

I have combed over them in slow motion and have seen that i do end up having an extended knee on my release which means my center of gravity is behind my plant leg and not over it. This will be something I will make my most important task to experiment first with to see how that impacts my throws. I was unaware i was even leading with elbow, just trying to pull through in a straight line. But now that you mention it, I will try and enforce its role and smash through as MB puts it :-)

Thanks again, you guys are the best. Hopefully tomorrow will lead to some better control and who knows, some more consistent distance!
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Postby mark12b » Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:37 pm

a few things i see in the putting clips:

- sometimes your followthrough goes toward the sky rather than the basket. try to reach toward the basket and also to keep that followthrough consistent from throw to throw.

- try a more compact motion overall, with more pop. a 20' putt really doesn't need much energy... as an exercise it's fun to see just how little motion it takes (with no followthrough, even)

- it looks like you've got the index finger flat out along the rim. try curling it under a little, so that you can feel the disc between the thumb and forefinger. for me it's more of an awareness than a pinch, and it helps me remember that i'm tossing something rather than just going through a motion with a disc in my hand. it also gets the finger out of the way at release.
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