Disqualified after the round...

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Re: Disqualified after the round...

Postby Pwingles » Sat Oct 29, 2011 5:13 pm

i dont know this person, but IMO, if you get a warning on player conduct during the round and you do it more then you should be punished. After the tourney is over, his mouth shouldve gotten him in trouble but not had any bearing on how he finished during the tourney, where technically he wouldnt be punished since the violation(s) either didnt happen again or werent brought up as a problem.


Guy sounds like a dick fwiw, and maybe this is a good thing for him, im just not sure im ready to advocate post round penalties for things that are only a violation during a game (not 100% clear on this btw, so if im incorrect then i apologize). Should he have talked to TD or anyone for that matter like he was, no. But surely there is another means of reprimand. Like a ban on future events or something along those lines.
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Re: Disqualified after the round...

Postby jenb » Sun Oct 30, 2011 3:28 pm

It does seem weird thatyou could be disqualified for something that occurred after cards were turned in. Suspended from future tournaments, sure. But once the card is turned in, you can drink alcohol, throw practice throws, and jump putt inside the circle all you want without it affecting your score or anything. So be warned. Cursing out the TD at tournament HQ before conclusion of the tournament, but after the card was turned in, can be grounds for disqualification. Note that he could have cursed out the TD after the ceremony and not be DQd. Is there any thing else you can do during that time frame between the last round and the ceremony that can result in disqualfication, but would be without consequence if it occurred after the ceremony?
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Re: Disqualified after the round...

Postby money 21 » Sun Oct 30, 2011 4:12 pm

in this case though ( if i understand correctly) he was warned for his behavior during the round and on probation for previous infractions so i think good call. if this was a first offence i think it would be harsh.
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Re: Disqualified after the round...

Postby Pwingles » Sun Oct 30, 2011 6:10 pm

money 21 wrote:in this case though ( if i understand correctly) he was warned for his behavior during the round and on probation for previous infractions so i think good call. if this was a first offence i think it would be harsh.



I see your point, but the warnings were because his behavior was not OK and indeed an actual offense for during the tournament. The difference being during the tourney is a violation, after just makes him still a dick. As far as the probation, this should indeed be taken into account, for everything that happens after the tournament, and whatever action is taken should only affect his being able to play and under what circumstances for future PDGA events, being that the play from the tourney in question is completed.

Like i said, dude sounds like the exact kind of person you dread playing with, but I think this is a case of someone abusing their TD powers maybe, im still not even sure he can actually do that.
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Re: Disqualified after the round...

Postby Fritz » Sun Oct 30, 2011 6:53 pm

Yeah, I've heard that if you warn him, he watches you like a hawk and tells you he's going to watch you like a hawk.
Either way. Some of the grey area, they were adding cards up and he was lingering etc...
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Re: Disqualified after the round...

Postby JHern » Sun Oct 30, 2011 9:22 pm

I think he is in a no-win position. PDGA should probably move toward full suspension after this episode, given he is already on probation. Threatening to sue the PDGA is not going to help his case.

He reacted like a maniac when he failed to register for Worlds during the invite-only period (he was invited), and then also failed to register during the pro-only period, and then found out that it was sold out after it opened up to all PDGA members. He was cussing everybody, including the local organizing committee, who in fact had nothing at all to do with handling the registration (it is handled completely by the PDGA). But then he became obsessed with getting in anyways, said he didn't need to follow the guidelines, and kept harping and whining and groaning and moaning. In the end, Brian Graham jumped everybody on the wait list in order to let him register for Worlds, which angered many locals and caused a lot of friction between PDGA and the local crew (including myself).

He has serious problems, and I want the best for him, but I'm not sure that we've been doing right by him, letting this kind of behavior continue to pass muster. Rob's dramas have spread like a cancer, and damaged other people's relationships with one another, and that's really where you have to draw the line.
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Re: Disqualified after the round...

Postby money 21 » Sun Oct 30, 2011 9:36 pm

he should have been DQ during the round. You get called in something on a curtsy violation and threaten another player I would have called a second violation right there and ended it. I hate premadonas on the course.

One question did the td refund the dudes entry fee, and ask for the players pack back?
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Re: Disqualified after the round...

Postby Fritz » Sun Oct 30, 2011 9:43 pm

Well spoken J.

money 21 wrote:One question did the td refund the dudes entry fee, and ask for the players pack back?


Not sure on that. I split after the blow up. I didn't cash and had not reason to stick around.
He was nuts and freaking out and I didn't want to be there in the event he came back and did something stupid.
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Re: Disqualified after the round...

Postby BLURR » Tue Nov 01, 2011 2:05 pm

Sounds like this dude needs an old fashioned ass whooping.

IMO, a tournament is finished when the last award is handed out. If you get busted for any rule infraction after turning in the card, but before the awards have been handed out, then too bad. I say good call by the TD.
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Re: Disqualified after the round...

Postby veganray » Tue Nov 01, 2011 2:15 pm

Though your opinion doesn't matter one whit, it just so happens to be in agreement with the PDGA rulebook, the only opinion that does matter. 804.03G(1):
Penalties may be assessed at whatever time the infraction is discovered until the director declares the tournament officially over or all awards have been distributed.
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Re: Disqualified after the round...

Postby zj1002 » Tue Nov 01, 2011 2:34 pm

JHern wrote: In the end, Brian Graham jumped everybody on the wait list in order to let him register for Worlds, which angered many locals and caused a lot of friction between PDGA and the local crew (including myself).


similar thing happened at Collegiate Nationals. The Oregon team caused a lot of drama at NCDGC this year. One of their players threw a couple fits on the course. One time he literally sat down on the ground and delayed his card until Brian Graham came out to rule if he could take relief off a fence. This fence was like 1 ft tall and placed near the basket with the purpose of prevent skips. The other team contested him taking relief, which he had already done without asking about it before hand. Honestly it was an issue the NCDGC staff should have addressed on the rule sheet. That same player was later kicked out of the tournament( and stroked for his behaviour) on Saturday for cursing out Brian Graham(I think it was Brian). I believe he had already been giving a warning and has a history of being like this. Sunday morning the Oregon team threw a fit and begged them to let the hot head player back into the round. He was allowed to play and Oregon went on to win the title. some of you that live/play in Oregon probably know who I am talking about

Pretty much every team in the collegiate ranks is anti-Oregon. During the final round there were plenty of people cheering when they made mistakes. In the B-team division they allowed an Oregon competitor to re-putt with no penatly after her putter fell out of her hand(my buddies on the Texas State B-Team called her for a stroke). They also allowed the Oregon team to change cards because they "wanted a piece" of the first place Texas State team. The TD bumped Oregon up and knocked down the team that was in second place. Needless to say my boys wrecked the feldberg coached oregon brats.

Much of that however is my own personal gripe with how NCDGC was run last year. Some very shady stuff, like how they allowed some 1000 rated pros into an AM event which then made the rounds non-sanctioned. It was weird playing in a non-sanctioned tournament yet the PDGA was heavily visible with dgplanet.tv and people like Brian Graham around every corner. A lot of rules got bent and plenty of teams felt disrespected.

so yeah sorry for derailing the thread but JHerns post stirred me up
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Re: Disqualified after the round...

Postby warobert » Tue Nov 01, 2011 5:20 pm

Yes ZJ, use the anger inside of you. Feel the power of the dark side!
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Re: Disqualified after the round...

Postby Fritz » Tue Nov 01, 2011 6:53 pm

veganray wrote:Though your opinion doesn't matter one whit, it just so happens to be in agreement with the PDGA rulebook, the only opinion that does matter. 804.03G(1):
Penalties may be assessed at whatever time the infraction is discovered until the director declares the tournament officially over or all awards have been distributed.


There ya go.
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Re: Disqualified after the round...

Postby Leopard » Tue Nov 01, 2011 7:47 pm

ZJ i'll make you a free FUCK OREGON stamp :)
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Re: Disqualified after the round...

Postby Steady 26542 » Tue Nov 01, 2011 9:07 pm

Leopard wrote:ZJ i'll make you a free FUCK OREGON stamp :)

I'll take one. :mrgreen:
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