Maxing out @ 300ft...

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Re: Maxing out @ 300ft...

Postby jubuttib » Sat Apr 17, 2010 4:26 pm

Lithicon wrote:Heh, it's hard to correlate that for most people in terms of throwing a disc especially the way you explained it there as there are lots of variables into cornering that I personally can't relate. Just that conservation of momentum, which does essentially correlate both in this sense. I'm going to assume that's what you meant, and not start a cornering debate in this thread. :lol:

What I kinda sorta meant was that the entry to a corner from the outside is the reachback, you try to get in as tight to the apex as you can (get the disc tight to your chest, apex of the corner sort of being the equivalent of your right peck in the throw) and then you find the perfect spot to accelerate out of the corner and hit the exit of the corner on the outside again (accelerating late from your chest and releasing the disc in front of you) with maximum acceleration to get the most speed on the following straight (getting the most disc speed, not arm speed).

Depending on the corner, the fastest way through the corner itself is often to go in as fast as you can and brake right through the corner. This can get you through the corner phenomenally fast, but the downside is that your car is pretty much parked at the exit, and everyone who braked for the corner entry properly will now be overtaking you. You just saved maybe a 1/10th of a second on the corner but lost 3-5 seconds on the straight. This reminds me of trying to accelerate the disc as hard as you can right from the start and then just ending up slowing down on the point of release. You got through the throwing motion more quickly but you didn't get any speed on the disc. Starting slow and accelerating only when the time is right will have you accelerating through the hit (or the exit of the corner) and gets your disc farther out there and your car to the next corner faster.

But yeah, enough of this. =)
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Re: Maxing out @ 300ft...

Postby patdabunny » Sat Apr 17, 2010 6:45 pm

jubuttib wrote:Depending on the corner, the fastest way through the corner itself is often to go in as fast as you can and brake right through the corner.


Uh, no. Try pushing your car to the limit and hit the brakes in the middle of the corner and see what happens. Trust me, it won't be nice. Always get your braking finished before the corner begins and before you turn. Brake in a straight line.

Sorry, but had to correct you. It'll make you a better driver! :lol:
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Re: Maxing out @ 300ft...

Postby jubuttib » Sat Apr 17, 2010 7:45 pm

drledford93 wrote:
jubuttib wrote:Depending on the corner, the fastest way through the corner itself is often to go in as fast as you can and brake right through the corner.


Uh, no. Try pushing your car to the limit and hit the brakes in the middle of the corner and see what happens. Trust me, it won't be nice. Always get your braking finished before the corner begins and before you turn. Brake in a straight line.

Sorry, but had to correct you. It'll make you a better driver! :lol:

That's the fastest way if you plan on having good lap time and, like I said, the best speed coming out of the corner, not necessarily if you're just wanting to get through the corner in the least amount of time possible. Think about it like this: Normally the finish line would be pretty far away from the exit of the last corner and you need to navigate the corner with the intent of getting maximum acceleration and speed on the straight to get to the finish line in least time possible. If the finish line was however right at the corner exit and you just had to reach it as fast as possible (without even considering if you might crash into a wall after the corner) you'd probably choose a dramatically later braking point.

This sort of cornering has no use apart from a theoretical contest to the end of a corner. It would slow you down dramatically on every straight and is completely useless if the timing gate isn't right where the corner ends and you have to worry about wrecking the car.

Braking "too late" you can get ahead of the others in the entry of a corner, get to the apex quicker and assuming the corner isn't very tight even reach the exit in less time. You'll be pretty much stationary though and the guys who did it right will now pass you because they're accelerating out of the corner, where as you were decelerating. If the contest was just about who reaches the exit of the corner first, you won. If you actually need to drive a proper lap, they won. It's the difference between trying to get your throwing motion done the fastest and trying to get the most speed on the disc.

And you don't necessarily have to get your braking done before the corner even if you're driving for real. Ever heard of trail braking? =)
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Re: Maxing out @ 300ft...

Postby emiller3 » Sat Apr 17, 2010 9:21 pm

So I admit, I stopped following this thread for a while. Sorry if I'm dumping this in the middle of some big discussion.

After trying the towel drill on and off through the last year, all I've gotten is a wooshing sound. Tonight, I finally got a CRACK, and it was music to my ears. Towel went straight out, popped HARD, and followed through like Blake's excellent diagram on page 5 indicated. I'm hopeful I can reproduce this with a disc in my hand at some point, I know it's tough.

My question is, what does it mean? Am I getting good wrist extension? Or is it late acceleration? Or does it just mean my timing was on? Body placement was on? What, if anything, is going to happen if I hit it like this with a disc in my hand?
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Re: Maxing out @ 300ft...

Postby patdabunny » Sun Apr 18, 2010 6:51 am

emiller3 wrote:So I admit, I stopped following this thread for a while. Sorry if I'm dumping this in the middle of some big discussion.

After trying the towel drill on and off through the last year, all I've gotten is a wooshing sound. Tonight, I finally got a CRACK, and it was music to my ears. Towel went straight out, popped HARD, and followed through like Blake's excellent diagram on page 5 indicated. I'm hopeful I can reproduce this with a disc in my hand at some point, I know it's tough.

My question is, what does it mean? Am I getting good wrist extension? Or is it late acceleration? Or does it just mean my timing was on? Body placement was on? What, if anything, is going to happen if I hit it like this with a disc in my hand?


I've recently done the same thing and have VERY LOUD pops. (Almost sounds like a firecracker sometimes.) I found that it's mainly due to 1) stopping my hips at 90 deg from the target; 2) relaxing my arm; and most importantly 3) accelerating ONLY after the hand reaches the chest (or power zone).

Congrats! Good feeling, isn't it?
My putter doinks harder than yours!

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Re: Maxing out @ 300ft...

Postby MrScoopa » Sun Apr 18, 2010 6:51 am

I believe it means you are accelerating into the hit which would mean your timing was on. Also, I get wrist extension while doing it if I do Blake's tip on "act like you are tugging back on a rope".
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Re: Maxing out @ 300ft...

Postby emiller3 » Sun Apr 18, 2010 7:12 am

drledford93 wrote:
emiller3 wrote:So I admit, I stopped following this thread for a while. Sorry if I'm dumping this in the middle of some big discussion.

After trying the towel drill on and off through the last year, all I've gotten is a wooshing sound. Tonight, I finally got a CRACK, and it was music to my ears. Towel went straight out, popped HARD, and followed through like Blake's excellent diagram on page 5 indicated. I'm hopeful I can reproduce this with a disc in my hand at some point, I know it's tough.

My question is, what does it mean? Am I getting good wrist extension? Or is it late acceleration? Or does it just mean my timing was on? Body placement was on? What, if anything, is going to happen if I hit it like this with a disc in my hand?


I've recently done the same thing and have VERY LOUD pops. (Almost sounds like a firecracker sometimes.) I found that it's mainly due to 1) stopping my hips at 90 deg from the target; 2) relaxing my arm; and most importantly 3) accelerating ONLY after the hand reaches the chest (or power zone).

Congrats! Good feeling, isn't it?

I was consciously working on #2 an 3, #1 I think was happening incidentally. It's definitely a good feeling, but I'll feel better if I'm able to actually see some improvements from it on the field.
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Re: Maxing out @ 300ft...

Postby patdabunny » Sun Apr 18, 2010 7:57 am

emiller3 wrote:I was consciously working on #2 an 3, #1 I think was happening incidentally. It's definitely a good feeling, but I'll feel better if I'm able to actually see some improvements from it on the field.


I haven't been able to translate it yet, but I think I haven't been really focusing on accelerating as hard as I was with a towel. Also, I think my grip is VERY weak due to several issues. I think it will translate. Just be identical between the disc and towel forms and you'll see an improvement, I'm sure.
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Re: Maxing out @ 300ft...

Postby MotoDj » Tue Apr 27, 2010 8:56 pm

??? i missed it to? i dont think that post was meant for this page... wrote in wrong window... sorry,
Last edited by MotoDj on Thu Apr 29, 2010 8:22 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Maxing out @ 300ft...

Postby patdabunny » Thu Apr 29, 2010 8:02 pm

MotoDj wrote:sso sad you didnt wear your jimmie...


Did I miss something?
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Re: Maxing out @ 300ft...

Postby Lithicon » Thu Apr 29, 2010 11:06 pm

jubuttib wrote:
Lithicon wrote:Heh, it's hard to correlate that for most people in terms of throwing a disc especially the way you explained it there as there are lots of variables into cornering that I personally can't relate. Just that conservation of momentum, which does essentially correlate both in this sense. I'm going to assume that's what you meant, and not start a cornering debate in this thread. :lol:

What I kinda sorta meant was that the entry to a corner from the outside is the reachback, you try to get in as tight to the apex as you can (get the disc tight to your chest, apex of the corner sort of being the equivalent of your right peck in the throw) and then you find the perfect spot to accelerate out of the corner and hit the exit of the corner on the outside again (accelerating late from your chest and releasing the disc in front of you) with maximum acceleration to get the most speed on the following straight (getting the most disc speed, not arm speed).

Depending on the corner, the fastest way through the corner itself is often to go in as fast as you can and brake right through the corner. This can get you through the corner phenomenally fast, but the downside is that your car is pretty much parked at the exit, and everyone who braked for the corner entry properly will now be overtaking you. You just saved maybe a 1/10th of a second on the corner but lost 3-5 seconds on the straight. This reminds me of trying to accelerate the disc as hard as you can right from the start and then just ending up slowing down on the point of release. You got through the throwing motion more quickly but you didn't get any speed on the disc. Starting slow and accelerating only when the time is right will have you accelerating through the hit (or the exit of the corner) and gets your disc farther out there and your car to the next corner faster.

But yeah, enough of this. =)


This is why I said I didn't want to make a cornering discussion in this thread, because it derails the topic. Lol. Using one profession to explain a simple task isn't easy when most people don't understand proper cornering. It might help 1 person, but ultimately doesn't add to the topic greatly. Not to say you weren't trying, it's just hard for most people to grasp concepts like that and often confuses them more. I can kind of see your reasoning in this, but I honestly doubt most people get it.

Conservation of momentum coming into the power zone then exploding out is the goal. Easy in, fast out. As Blake said before, the speed gained from the power zone out is the only important part. If you pull 70 into the power zone, but decrease to 40-50 through to the hit, you're wasting power. It doesn't matter how fast you go into the power zone, IT ONLY matters that you come out of the power zone faster than you went into it. The acceleration to the hit is what builds the power that "CAN" lead to a big hit. This is why the Right pec drill works so well in a way, it's focusing you not to pull till your hit the power zone. But, you need to have the timing correct to make the hit happen correctly. It will happen regardless, but you might not be HITTING it.

emiller3 wrote:So I admit, I stopped following this thread for a while. Sorry if I'm dumping this in the middle of some big discussion.

After trying the towel drill on and off through the last year, all I've gotten is a wooshing sound. Tonight, I finally got a CRACK, and it was music to my ears. Towel went straight out, popped HARD, and followed through like Blake's excellent diagram on page 5 indicated. I'm hopeful I can reproduce this with a disc in my hand at some point, I know it's tough.

My question is, what does it mean? Am I getting good wrist extension? Or is it late acceleration? Or does it just mean my timing was on? Body placement was on? What, if anything, is going to happen if I hit it like this with a disc in my hand?


It could mean all of them, and it could mean part of it. It can be hard to tell, timing is more than likely the thing with some late acceleration. Wrist extension is the hardest to get, but could very well be in effect.
What, if anything, is going to happen if I hit it like this with a disc in my hand?
THIS PART, is up to you. What you do with this feeling you got from snapping the towel, if you learn from that and can translate it to the disc, it will help. BUT, that's where you have to start practicing like you're snapping the towel when you get a disc in your hand and make that change, don't just go back to throwing the disc just like you've been doing.
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Re: Maxing out @ 300ft...

Postby patdabunny » Fri Apr 30, 2010 12:21 pm

MotoDj wrote:??? i missed it to? i dont think that post was meant for this page... wrote in wrong window... sorry,


That's ok...I just thought it was my age showing... :lol:
My putter doinks harder than yours!

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Re: Maxing out @ 300ft...

Postby rhatton2 » Tue May 04, 2010 6:55 am

Hi,

Haven't been on the site for a couple of months as was off getting married (ruining any chance of me now ever getting good at this game...)

Have come back to a whole host of reading and there's some fantastic stuff in here. One thing that keeps popping up is the throwing the pen, can someone give me a link to this thread as I can't find the original and want to know exactly what I'm supposed to do with it.
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Re: Maxing out @ 300ft...

Postby jubuttib » Tue May 04, 2010 9:41 am

rhatton2 wrote:Hi,

Haven't been on the site for a couple of months as was off getting married (ruining any chance of me now ever getting good at this game...)

Have come back to a whole host of reading and there's some fantastic stuff in here. One thing that keeps popping up is the throwing the pen, can someone give me a link to this thread as I can't find the original and want to know exactly what I'm supposed to do with it.

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=17201

There you go.
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Re: Maxing out @ 300ft...

Postby rhatton2 » Tue May 04, 2010 9:44 am

legend, thanks!
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