The Myth of Disc Pivot

[BrotherDave]

Actually, I think my problem is my weak ass grip. I tried keeping my hand in a fist during my follow through and drives were acting like they were slowing down quite a bit less.

[masterbeato]

The pull line image isn't so much about coming in at an angle as it is getting into the power pocket with a shoulder pause. The abrupt turn is telling of how far forward Dan gets the disc before chopping his elbow, how slow the disc is going when it gets there, and then how explosive the acceleration is during his elbow/wrist release. It's all about the increasing arc radius or w/e Blake was talking about in that other thread but there is some funky stuff that goes on in the muscles of his arms and hands that makes him a distance freak too.

If you've been stuck at 350' for a long time BroD, you probably rotate your shoulders too fast too early, don't get your elbow forward enough, grip too hard and too early, and don't have your weight centered during your throw. Being off balance can really kill the pace of your shot, as you're forced into bad timing because you're essentially falling over. Also, a video critique is the obvious way to get useful feedback that isn't speculation.

I am learning a lot about my throw in this thread, funny I have not seen Blake post this thread to begin with. Of course it has been about a year since I have been fully active on this site due to life's busy chores.

Cat, my muscles are freaky because I do a lot of wrist pushups nah, I do a lot of workouts that strengthen fast twitch fibers.

My intake on all of this, when it first started to make sense to me I accompanied Blake quite a lot last year (2012 now, geez!) with a few gentlemen on this newly found "rail" theory. Pulling from outside-in is something I consciously made an effort to do so because I accidentally did something weird once on the course and had an immediate "2nd" breakthrough, but it wasn't just the outside-in pull as a lot of players do this, even though that was what made me realize that I am doing something else far superior of what I was previously doing. I did not realize what it was until I spent another godawful aching 13 hours in the field.

The explanation fits perfectly of how I felt while I was throwing with this new found technique, and I found it by going back to the grass roots of where it all started, and I basically tweeked a bigger circular motion I got from the pec drill while gaining faster acceleration due to the new redirection while I was experimenting with the "outside-in" pull. My throw is very "pec drill" savvy. Easy to control and very consistent, also easy to find flaws if I am having a bad day and that is all I shaped my throw around in the last 3 - 4 years or so, not power. Power just came from experimenting from my mistakes.

[masterbeato]

I would absolutely love to see an overhead camera view of Beto throwing. It's really hard for me to conceptualize this rail thing without seeing it in real time and I tried watching the "driving with Dan Beto" vid but it just looks like any other throw.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pj6kpdnYJzc

Here you go BrotherDave, this is a vanity video "MyThrow" shot last year and it has some angles and an overhead shot (1:58) including one in slow motion at 2:04.

Sorry it took so long!

[Stringbean]

Happy new year MB! Hope to hear more from you in 2013.

"I do a lot of workouts that strengthen fast twitch fibers." - Can you expand on this? Obviously good form is more important than muscular development but I have been experimenting lately with plyometric excercises that complement disc golf motions and am curious what kind of excercises you do to strengthen fast twitch muscles.

[masterbeato]

Happy new year MB! Hope to hear more from you in 2013.

"I do a lot of workouts that strengthen fast twitch fibers." - Can you expand on this? Obviously good form is more important than muscular development but I have been experimenting lately with plyometric excercises that complement disc golf motions and am curious what kind of excercises you do to strengthen fast twitch muscles.

Agreed, I just do these exercises to avoid long term injury and keep my body in shape and more consistent with my throw. There is really no good reason to "not" workout in my opinion. I just basically use a hand exerciser and clamp down short quick bursts as opposed to slowly closing your hand with the device. It is like doing any other exercise but you do it quickly in short bursts. I do it for my legs, abs, shoulders, arms and hands. It is very tiring but eventually you start seeing the benefits.

[masterbeato]

Oh geez how could I forget! Happy New Year!!!

[JR]

You too

[chunk]

I would absolutely love to see an overhead camera view of Beto throwing. It's really hard for me to conceptualize this rail thing without seeing it in real time and I tried watching the "driving with Dan Beto" vid but it just looks like any other throw.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pj6kpdnYJzc

Here you go BrotherDave, this is a vanity video "MyThrow" shot last year and it has some angles and an overhead shot (1:58) including one in slow motion at 2:04.

Sorry it took so long!

wow, great video dan. your throw is so smooth. was that all filled at the valley dgc? i got a chance to play that course on a very windy day in october and still loved it.

[Stringbean]

Agreed, I just do these exercises to avoid long term injury and keep my body in shape and more consistent with my throw. There is really no good reason to "not" workout in my opinion. I just basically use a hand exerciser and clamp down short quick bursts as opposed to slowly closing your hand with the device. It is like doing any other exercise but you do it quickly in short bursts. I do it for my legs, abs, shoulders, arms and hands. It is very tiring but eventually you start seeing the benefits.

I've been doing the exact same thing with the hand excerciser, I keep it in my car and us it during my 40 minute commute. By the time I get to work, I can barely type. Lunges seem to help out a great deal with balance. Very important for me because I have long skinny legs. When I stop working out, my distance and accuracy suffer.

[masterbeato]

I would absolutely love to see an overhead camera view of Beto throwing. It's really hard for me to conceptualize this rail thing without seeing it in real time and I tried watching the "driving with Dan Beto" vid but it just looks like any other throw.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pj6kpdnYJzc

Here you go BrotherDave, this is a vanity video "MyThrow" shot last year and it has some angles and an overhead shot (1:58) including one in slow motion at 2:04.

Sorry it took so long!

wow, great video dan. your throw is so smooth. was that all filled at the valley dgc? i got a chance to play that course on a very windy day in october and still loved it.

Thanks Chunk, yes it was filmed at the Valley. Extremely fun course. I am liking the new changes made to the course as well.

Agreed, I just do these exercises to avoid long term injury and keep my body in shape and more consistent with my throw. There is really no good reason to "not" workout in my opinion. I just basically use a hand exerciser and clamp down short quick bursts as opposed to slowly closing your hand with the device. It is like doing any other exercise but you do it quickly in short bursts. I do it for my legs, abs, shoulders, arms and hands. It is very tiring but eventually you start seeing the benefits.

I've been doing the exact same thing with the hand excerciser, I keep it in my car and us it during my 40 minute commute. By the time I get to work, I can barely type. Lunges seem to help out a great deal with balance. Very important for me because I have long skinny legs. When I stop working out, my distance and accuracy suffer.

haha thats awesome. yeah i find if i stop working out muscles i am used to working out with i get fatigue i am not used to and my game tends to slow down, lack of concentration probably because of the lack of juices flowing through.

[PMantle]

Dan,

What's that song in that video? Thanks.

[keltik]

Dan, what are you putting with nowadays? what's in your bag in general? you've been MIA for a while now...

[jwb]

Is it bad to curl the disc a little toward your forearm? To try an adding a little more pivot or snap. It almost looks like Wysocki does this.

[JR]

Wysocki tilts the disc somewhat upright and that adds power to the snap.

[Stringbean]

Is it bad to curl the disc a little toward your forearm? To try an adding a little more pivot or snap. It almost looks like Wysocki does this.

It should happen naturally if you keep your wrist loose and the disc close to your chest during the pull.