Hyzer flip question

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Hyzer flip question

Postby TexasOutlaw » Thu May 11, 2006 10:08 am

Hey guys. When throwing hyzer flips, do you aim off to the left so that the disc flips to straight?

Or do you turn the disc, letting the hyzer bring it back before flipping to straight? I was playing around yesterday, and could not remember where I should be aiming.

In other words, I believe I am confusing a flex shot with a hyzer flip. But, I guess my flex shots are with overstable molds.
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Postby discmonkey42 » Thu May 11, 2006 10:27 am

When I flip something, I throw it so that the "flipping" portion of the flight is in a straight line. Some of my discs have a slight amount of L-R play while flipping so in the woods I adjust. Also, some discs I flip to flat and straight so I aim considering the low speed fade. Some, I flip into an S so have to account for the S. Some, I flip into a big right turn. I guess my answer is that it depends on the disc and shot you are trying to throw.
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Postby Blake_T » Thu May 11, 2006 1:40 pm

you are confusing a flex shot with a hyzer flip.

a flex shot can be performed with any disc. it basically just describes a shot that turns and flexes out, usually with more of a stall flex than a nose down finish.
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Postby Blake_T » Thu May 11, 2006 1:44 pm

generally you will aim hyzer flips slightly left of center since it forces the disc more nose down on that line.

also you have to differentiate from hyzer flips that flatten and fly straight vs. ones that flip over and turn.

on the straight flying ones you generally have to aim straight ahead.
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Postby Jestyr » Thu May 11, 2006 2:57 pm

I did my first hyzer-flip today!!! I went out to some football fields near my house to get in some practice.

I decided to bring along my Archangel, which I decided a while I didn't like, becuase it is my most understable disc.

After a few disappointing tries, I did it! I threw it with a slight hyzer ang le and then it flattened out and started to go right... and it kept going and going before finally running out of steam and fading a bit to the left.

All in all, it was about 20' off my center line and it went about 335'. This is my personal best! Before I was around the 225-250 range.

Well, riding the high of the successful hyzer-flip with the AA. I tried it with my very beat up Teebird. While noot as successful as my AA as far as distance, it did flatten out and go a ways more for a 310' throw.

So, I am super excited at this point and decide to do some normal flat throws with my other drivers. I was (for me) on fire! I was keeping the nose down and I even heard a "pop" when I released. I was keeping all my discs pretty straight (even the star teebirds) and was going arouns 275'! I have officially gotten past my plateau!!!

I know these distances are not great by most people's standards, but they are a step up for me!

Thanks to all on the forum for their suggestions and general helpfulness. :)
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Postby Muffin_Man » Thu May 11, 2006 6:36 pm

What is the difference in technique between throwing an understable disc on a hyzer angle and not having it flip up on you, vs throwing the same understable disc on a hyzer-flip and having it flip up?
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Postby Blake_T » Thu May 11, 2006 8:10 pm

one of them flips and the other one holds the line? :P

a sweeping hyzer that holds its line is generally a nose up hyzer (pulled to the right).
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Postby kling » Sun May 14, 2006 3:07 pm

I think I did a hyzer flip today. I threw a very beat up (but never warped) Gazelle with a hyzer. It flipped up straight for about 70% of its flight path then faded left (think I read hyzer flips shouldn't fade noticable maybe I threw it nose up). Anyways It was a slight headwind and it was my longest measured throw yet (280 feet). :)
I really wish I could throw shots like these consistantly during a round.[/i]
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Postby Blake_T » Sun May 14, 2006 9:43 pm

that was indeed a hyzer flip.
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Postby roadkill » Mon May 15, 2006 8:29 am

Muffin_Man wrote:What is the difference in technique between throwing an understable disc on a hyzer angle and not having it flip up on you, vs throwing the same understable disc on a hyzer-flip and having it flip up?


There are a few factors in play to determine whether an understable disc hyzers, hyzer flips to a straight line or flips into a turnover shot.

1) stability of the disc thrown
2) angle of release
3) amount of snap/power
4) smoothness of throw

(You could also list disc attitude -nose up vs nose down but I personally wouldn't change that for directional purposes)

Let's say you have an understable disc that if thrown with x amount of power will flip 30 degrees before maintaining it's angle.

A) If you want to hyzerflip it on a straightline you'd give it 30 degrees of hyzer at release and it would flip up to flat and then should remain on a straight path until it late in it's flight where it either drops straight to the ground or falls slightly left (rhbh).

B) With that same disc using the same amount of power you could increase the hyzer release to 60 degrees which after flipping up 30 degrees would have it traveling at a 30 degree hyzer angle. This would result in maintaining a hyzer flight.

C) If you wanted a turnover shot you could release the same disc with the same power with 15 degrees of hyzer and it would flip over 30 degrees into a 15 degree anhyzer angle and result in a controlled turnover shot. (Releasing flat would likely result in disc landing on its roll shoulder and more resemble a cut roller)

D) Another option using the same disc at the same power would be to release it with 40 degrees of anhyzer and it would flip over 30 degrees and land at 70 degrees and result in a nifty backhand roller shot.

One disc, 4 totally different shots. You can change the angle and come up with many variations of lines and that's only changing the angle of release. Changing the amount of power would also manipulate the disc into different lines. Naturally the harder you throw the more hyzer angle you'll need to achieve the same shot.

I believe you should strive to be smooth in your acceleration through release. If you are herky jerky this will hurt your consistency and usually make the disc flip harder than with a smoother shot.

However on occassion (very rare) I may purposely be jerky with my acceleration/release to achieve some sort of trick shot from a compromised lie (usually something like a U shaped roller from a kneeling or stretched position to get around a mando or dogleg).

I'm very old school in my disc selections and disc strategy. I typically only use 5-7 discs in a round. I prefer to use one disc for several different purposes by manipulating the aforementioned factors rather than carry several discs to each serve a single purpose.

Want to be consistent? know your plastic
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Postby garublador » Mon May 15, 2006 8:59 am

roadkill wrote:
(You could also list disc attitude -nose up vs nose down but I personally wouldn't change that for directional purposes)


I find that adjusting the attitude of the disc is a great way to control the direction of the throw. A disc thrown nose down at say 30 degrees of hyzer may flip up to flat and fly really straight. The same disc thrown with the same hyzer angle, but nose up may hold a hyzer for the entire flight. One of the articles on this site goes into this in pretty good depth.

http://www.discgolfreview.com/resources ... gles.shtml
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Postby roadkill » Mon May 15, 2006 9:52 am

The reason I rarely manipulate disc attitude for directional purposes is that it throws an added uneccessary variable into the equation. I try for a flat attitude with 95% of shots other than airbounces (nose up) or tailwind aided distance shots (slight nose down).

I've found that releasing the disc nose up will keep the disc in the air longer (except in significant tailwind) so it may help in hyzering harder left or turning more right than if released flat. I also use nose up for airbounce shots which allows me to control the speed and distance of a shot as in an approach from 75-150' .

But this manipulation is a tertiary adjustment after release angle and/or amount of snap. The airbounce shot is my most common application for the nose up angle. I rarely use nose down. When I do it's usually in conjunction with a roller or some sort or trick shot out of a tight lie.
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Postby TexasOutlaw » Mon May 15, 2006 11:53 am

Thanks Road. Sounds like what I call a hyzer flip. I give it about 30 deg, so that it straightens up and keeps going.

How much height do you give these?
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Postby Blake_T » Mon May 15, 2006 12:08 pm

nose angles (mung, pitch, attitude, etc. whatever term you wish to use) can vary simply based upon the left/right trajectory in conjunction with the disc hyzer/anhyzer angle.

e.g. if you were to attempt to pull a hyzer 45 degrees to the right of center, unless you are bent at the waist almost 90 degrees weight forward, this throw will expose flight plate very early and hold the hyzer angle (unless it is torque'd over).

just to add to roadkill's summary (but his was a good one) is that a handful of discs will not behave in the same way as most discs when flipped to flat.

true stable discs like a roc or teebird will often flip to flat without turning for a variety of hyzer angles (often up to ~20 degrees of play). the main difference between flipping the same disc up from 10 degrees to flat vs. 20 degrees to flat is that the disc flipped up from 10 will generally fade later in its flight than the one flipped up from 20.

as for height, it depends on the shot, length, line, etc.
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Postby kling » Mon May 15, 2006 12:49 pm

Which are the other true stable discs?
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