More Wrist Stuff

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Postby Bradley Walker » Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:21 pm

Watch timmy Gill.

Watch his thumb.

http://stickitdg.com/gallery/albums/Pro-Men-Drives/timmy_gill.avi

Look at the torque his actively applying.
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Postby Timko » Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:50 pm

I haven't watched that video in a while, but I just noticed his little pre-wrist extension he does before he goes into his pull back.
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Postby tumpsi » Wed Jun 11, 2008 12:15 am

I've been getting some good snaps lately, but most of the throws get a flutter. Am I gripping too hard or what? This happens only with distance drivers, so I presume it's got something to do with my grip or the wide rims.
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Postby TickMagnet » Wed Jun 11, 2008 7:38 am

slight wrist roll when you try and throw harder/change grips?
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Postby Decoy » Wed Jun 11, 2008 9:54 am

Went out and threw in a football field for a few hours yesterday, really worked on keeping my wrist relaxed and forcing it open a little earlier than normal. My timing is still surely off, I can't feel the hit as much when I do that but I hear more snap.

This made me realize that usually when my hit comes, I'm still fighting to keep my wrist closed. Got some great flight patterns out of the throws with more wrist extension, I just need to get the timing down. I'm still having trouble getting past 325 with either way.

off topic, had a few sidearm anhyzer bombs with my star destroyer that went from field goal post to field goal post, some even 5-10 yards further. With any luck I'll be breaking 400 consistently by the end of summer. It's weird tho, I never work on my sidearm anymore, just backhand. Seems some of the concepts are translating well from style to style.
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Postby Bradley Walker » Wed Jun 11, 2008 11:22 am

Furthur wrote:I haven't watched that video in a while, but I just noticed his little pre-wrist extension he does before he goes into his pull back.


Pre-programming the move.
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Postby geoloseth » Wed Jun 11, 2008 12:31 pm

Ive found that getting my wrist loose before I start my pull keeps my wrist from tightening up (watch my clips of driving) I've even incorporated the same thing in my putting in order to keep my wrist loose so the disc is released at 6 o'clock. It really helps.
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Postby JR » Wed Jun 11, 2008 2:32 pm

geoloseth wrote:Ive found that getting my wrist loose before I start my pull keeps my wrist from tightening up (watch my clips of driving) I've even incorporated the same thing in my putting in order to keep my wrist loose so the disc is released at 6 o'clock. It really helps.


Second. I do that pre programming of Gill on the longest attempts.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Postby Dale » Wed Jun 11, 2008 4:33 pm

I seriously implore everyone to try to start throwing with as little muscle tension in the upper arm you can with only enough tension in the forearm, hand and fingers to keep the disc in the correct orientation. You wouldn't believe without witnessing it first hand how much _faster_ your arm moves with loose muscles vs trying to huck far by consciously guiding your muscles. Whether you realize it or not I believe that's the case when one tries to throw hard.


I gotta try this! Sometimes when I practice I feel my forearm/hand/wrist is much looser but I get a great throw anyway. The only tension I MUST hold is the tension that keeps my wrist down. My hand tends to pop up unless I force my wrist to stay at a downward angle.
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Re: More Wrist Stuff

Postby Kenja » Fri Mar 06, 2009 3:46 pm

woot necro

There's a cool physiological 'trick' you can play on your muscles to get a little extra oomph.

Begin by tensing all the muscles in your arm. Hold this for the count of eight as you inhale. Now exhale and relax completely for an eight count. Let your arm go completely lax, as though you were sleeping. Feel the tension seep from your arm muscles, and enjoy the feeling.

Now, huck your disc, before your 30 seconds are up :lol:

Muscles become MORE relaxed after 'pre-tensioning' than if they are under zero load. Relaxed muscles have much more potential energy than tensed muscles. In fact, by definition, if *every* muscle fiber is tensed then the muscle cannot do any more work.
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Re: More Wrist Stuff

Postby Blake_T » Fri Mar 06, 2009 4:08 pm

ok so I was messing with this even more just now and the key is staying loose in the wrist. You physically cannot be loose in the wrist if you are cocking it as much as I was.


Aaron, you are correct in what you are finding but i will give more of a clarification on what i believe to be true.

the key here is:
relaxed wrist before the hit, flexed wrist during the wrist extension.

you don't want to be too loose and you won't get significant pop unless you tighten up... the key is this tightening at the right time.
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Re: More Wrist Stuff

Postby Bradley Walker » Sat Mar 07, 2009 8:17 pm

...and way more thumb lock pressure at the rip. Like crazy amounts of thumb pressure. The disc should EXPLODE out from the lock.

What I have found to "snap" (which is really mostly wrist extension):

Slow in. Arm in time with shoulder opening. Relaxed body. Loose.

Relaxed wrist. Bear down with the thumb on the plate. Not hard, but feel the plate (a lot). Feel the tie between the thumb line and the wrist. The two are linked.

The elbow is forward

Continue rotating the shoulders open and priming the legs and hips to explode open.

Wrist bows back from weight of the disc in the forward motion. Feel the muscles on the TOP of your arm stretch.

Move into hit arc (spot about 8" before the hit). The "arc" is made by your wrist going from closed to open. '

Stop the elbow. Yes. Stop the elbow. The only real way to extend the lower arm is to stop the elbow while continuing to open the shoulders. The shoulders continue to open but the elbow nearly stops in space, in fact it almost moves back and to the right.

Stopping the elbow starts the arm chop, and is the first step to flying the wrist open.

Fire the shoulders open.

The wrist (defined by where the thumb is pointing) transitions from pointing somewhat away from the target to somewhat toward the target. This is the ejection slot. This is ACTIVE ejection of the disc out of the hand.

Fire the muscles on the top of the arm to open the wrist. Tie this to the thumb. The thumb is the furthest point away in the arc that is defined by the wrist and grip. The muscles that open the wrist are the engine. The thumb is lever.

FIRE EVERYTHING open.

The acceleration reaches critical mass in a very short period of time at the disc.

BEAR DOWN AS HARD YOU CAN WITH THE THUMB AND INDEX FINGER LOCK AS THE DISC EJECTS. This is the last thing to leave the disc. All of the other fingers rip in order as the disc "rolls" down the hand.

If you pull to the right (since you have probably never used real ejection in your life) or grip lock with the new thumb grip pressure, you need to come in later (or more closed) before you fire.

If it comes out right or you feel your thumb slip off the plate, bear down harder with the thumb/index finger lock or SLOW DOWN COMING INTO THE HIT ARC. That is right...slow down coming in...

Slow in...light speed out, that creates a thing we call acceleration. We do not want arm speed either, we want EJECTION speed. Everything goes into creating ejection at the wrist. This will appear to be arm speed, but it is not.

The harder you can grip with the thumb and still eject the disc forward, the harder the snap.

I am pretty sure this is it...
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Re: More Wrist Stuff

Postby Star Shark » Sat Mar 07, 2009 10:30 pm

Bradley Walker wrote:...and way more thumb lock pressure at the rip. Like crazy amounts of thumb pressure. The disc should EXPLODE out from the lock.

BEAR DOWN AS HARD YOU CAN WITH THE THUMB AND INDEX FINGER LOCK AS THE DISC EJECTS. This is the last thing to leave the disc. All of the other fingers rip in order as the disc "rolls" down the hand.

If you pull to the right (since you have probably never used real ejection in your life) or grip lock with the new thumb grip pressure, you need to come in later (or more closed) before you fire.

If it comes out right or you feel your thumb slip off the plate, bear down harder with the thumb/index finger lock or SLOW DOWN COMING INTO THE HIT ARC. That is right...slow down coming in...

Slow in...light speed out, that creates a thing we call acceleration. We do not want arm speed either, we want EJECTION speed. Everything goes into creating ejection at the wrist. This will appear to be arm speed, but it is not.

The harder you can grip with the thumb and still eject the disc forward, the harder the snap.

I am pretty sure this is it...


This is big info for me. A big flaw in my throws apparently has been the utter lack of thumb pressure. Basically my thumb is on the top of the disc just cuz it happens to be attached at that point on my hand. Should be able to work something with more pressure :).
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Re: More Wrist Stuff

Postby JR » Sat Mar 07, 2009 11:23 pm

Great post Bradley. I'd like to add that squeezing hard with the index finger against the base of the index finger can also cause grip lock. That arm speed vs ejection speed definition is very important to grasp.

I think that correct form arm speed is the result of a good ejection speed. And false arm speed is moving the arm quickly anywhere before the hit. The acceleration of the ejection speed is what builds up the speed of the arm and the disc leading to the only proper arm speed. The only kind that also has a great spin rate on the disc. Thus preserving correct speed to spin ratio leading to straighter much longer flights.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: More Wrist Stuff

Postby Parks » Sun Mar 08, 2009 4:46 pm

Good post Bradley, but I'm having trouble getting the elbow stop thing to work.

Any more explanation on that part? Seems counter-intuitive, and I can't "chop" without extending my elbow.

Do you mean stop its forward motion or stop its rotation open?
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