Timing

Information, Questions, Discussion about Throwing Mechanics and Technique

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Postby WraithMe » Wed Aug 20, 2008 6:50 pm

I'd like to add one more thing relating to what I said two posts up. I believe it's very common to start the pull too early and waste much of the initial centrifugal acceleration from the hips and shoulder turn. To find the proper timing I actually stopped pulling my arm through at all and went to a 100% shoulder lead where I simply rotated and then chopped the elbow while it was back near my trailing shoulder resulting in a hit that is only slightly in front of my chest. It may sound weird, and it kind of is, but you would be surprised at the distance you can achieve this way. Anyway, after getting used to not pulling through early I knew it was time to add a bit of elbow lead and that's where my previous post comes in. Instead of leaving my arm back, when it hits that trailing shoulder area I start pulling through close to my chest. The results are pretty fantastic. Your mileage may vary.
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Postby black udder » Wed Aug 20, 2008 8:26 pm

bcsst26 wrote:Well I just got back in from a 2 hour field session. I have to say overall I think it was a success. I feel like I am pivoting the hips and getting power into it. Before my ankle would twist or feel like I am jamming it but my lower body actually felt smooth. I was having trouble of early releases and throwing things anhzyer. I think the early release was from not gripping it hard enough during the acceleartion and the anhyzer is from not bringing the disc close enough to my body? Could this cause it? I feel like when I get it close I get a good throw on the line I intended. The only thing that is throwing a red flag at me now is on my plant leg the side of my leg that is facing the target is sore? Mostly the quad area. Is this normal? I thought it was since I am using more of these muscles for the first time in pivoting the hips. But maybe it means something else that others can pick up on. Thanks for all the help. I will be reading these things a bunch, hitting the practice field big time and hopefully next week after some practice I will post a video so I can get more feedback.


Not sure what the muscle thing is - it might be that you're just incorporating those big leg muscles for the first time. I'd keep an eye on it to make sure you're not hurting yourself somehow.

As for the early release and anhzyer. Early release is grip related and could also mean that you're either getting your shoulders around too fast or pulling too far away from your chest. Either way, it just generates too much force on the disc at the wrong time.

I'd bet that the anhyzer is you either swooping or leaning back (to the right) at your release or some torque trying to get power.

Imagine you have a piece of string about nipple high that goes from the basket to the back of your tee pad. What you want is to throw your disc over that piece of string and then rotate your body so the string would be dead center through your chest at the end of your throw. What that would mean is that you've rotated fully and got your weight forward.
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Postby Blake_T » Tue Aug 26, 2008 1:10 am

I think the early release was from not gripping it hard enough during the acceleartion and the anhyzer is from not bringing the disc close enough to my body? Could this cause it?


getting too far off the body on an anhyzer will weaken the throw by a drastic amount.

early release is generally caused by 1 of 3 things that are both related to one another.

1. your pull is starting too late.
2. your elbow isn't coming through early enough.
3. you aren't "clearing your hand" with the disc (read as: your body position and timing are off so that your wrist extension lags behind coming into the power zone).

the right pec drill is designed so that the disc is forward and you are in a position to rotate your upper body and hit it out in front of you.

to develop smoothness with this motion try starting at your left pec. i find that if the disc is at or forward of my left pec when my foot hits the ground on an x-step that i can hit the disc much better than if it's back past my body.

the key is that when your shoulders open up and you enter the power zone, your hand should be in front of the disc. if you are faced up and your hand is still curled around the disc, it's going to come out early (or you'll hit a massive grip lock).
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Postby bcsst26 » Tue Aug 26, 2008 5:32 am

Blake_T wrote:
I think the early release was from not gripping it hard enough during the acceleartion and the anhyzer is from not bringing the disc close enough to my body? Could this cause it?


getting too far off the body on an anhyzer will weaken the throw by a drastic amount.

early release is generally caused by 1 of 3 things that are both related to one another.

1. your pull is starting too late.
2. your elbow isn't coming through early enough.
3. you aren't "clearing your hand" with the disc (read as: your body position and timing are off so that your wrist extension lags behind coming into the power zone).

the right pec drill is designed so that the disc is forward and you are in a position to rotate your upper body and hit it out in front of you.

to develop smoothness with this motion try starting at your left pec. i find that if the disc is at or forward of my left pec when my foot hits the ground on an x-step that i can hit the disc much better than if it's back past my body.

the key is that when your shoulders open up and you enter the power zone, your hand should be in front of the disc. if you are faced up and your hand is still curled around the disc, it's going to come out early (or you'll hit a massive grip lock).


Thanks for the suggestion. A lot of it makes sense. I will work on starting at my left pec and see if that makes a difference. Someone noted this weekend when playing a round that it looked like I had a pause in my throw. I wasn't sure what they were talking about. Maybe this is me starting my pull to late. I think this might be one of the first times I heard of someone doing this. So this is what I am going to work on tonight and for evenings to come. Please correct me if my concept is wrong. Practice from a standstill throw only bringing the disc back to my left pec. If I want a reachback that is further back I will simply reach back more with the elbow keeping the disc about at the left pec. I will work on this and see if I can feel the hit better. Several weeks ago I was "feeling it" big time. For about a week maybe two I was throwing further with more accuracy than ever. But for some reason that feeling has left me. I think these things may help me out. Thanks again.
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Postby Blake_T » Tue Aug 26, 2008 3:04 pm

If I want a reachback that is further back I will simply reach back more with the elbow keeping the disc about at the left pec. I will work on this and see if I can feel the hit better. Several weeks ago I was "feeling it" big time. For about a week maybe two I was throwing further with more accuracy than ever. But for some reason that feeling has left me. I think these things may help me out. Thanks again.


don't worry about how far the reach back is. relax. that is key. feel the timing so you can hit it hard AFTER you are smooth. you may need some lead in to help that. go back and read license to drive... think about sliding the disc in a straight line across your chest from the left to right pec (inside of the right pec) and feeling when your shoulders are supposed to rotate open. a return to basic fundamentals often helps. there's a reason people taught it that way in the first place :)

it's common to lose the feeling. during my "good year" when i was throwing 425'+ i had many off days... i had 2 bags of discs because i never knew what was going to show up. on good days i had 1 bag of discs... and about every other day was an off day that had another bag of discs.
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Postby black udder » Tue Aug 26, 2008 4:32 pm

Are you using an x-step when you get that "pause"? If so, it could be what mine was - that is - keeping your weight back too far. You want to keep your momentum centered as you go through your x-step, then at the plant and hit, you're up over your plant foot and beyond.

As for how you're throwing. You're going to have to just accept that your golf will suck while you work this out. Once you do that, it'll be much easier to just stand on a tee and throw for "feel" rather than distance. If you get it right, you'll get more distance than you expected. Once you can reproduce the feel, you can start to go for more power (as Blake said).

I would suggest spending more days on the practice field so you don't feel the urge to "play" rather than "practice". :)
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