Should I be throwing a Sidewinder?

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Postby swel304 » Sat Sep 23, 2006 1:58 pm

If you want a open field max D disc you dont need to be worried about trees.

yeah but I dont have the power to make the valk turn apparently, at least I havent made it happen properly yet. and when Im trying to throw that hard bad things happen, I may be aiming for open field but that damn tree always seems to jump out :lol: we have alot of OB roads that shred dx also, and somehow even in the fields I always seem to manage to hit somthing hard that takes a chunk out of the disc.
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Postby Thatdirtykid » Sat Sep 23, 2006 2:22 pm

if you dont have the power to turn a valk (I know the chart says valks require more power than a sidewidner, but again, valk is avalible in premium and base plastic) a dx valk requires the same amount of power as a sidewinder.

I reccomend a JLS (millineum only makes mid and premium grade plastic) or possibly a Z XL or something similar.

The jls is easier to throw well than a sidewinder, will turn well for max D and fade more predictably.

Really throwing a sidewinder is not a bad thing (as I said I used to throw them), there are just better options especially in the long run. A jls will not be as long as a sidewinder, but it will be more accurate/predictable, and in the long run help your game alot more than a sidewinder.
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Postby presidio hills » Sat Sep 23, 2006 3:27 pm

swel304 wrote:If I am just going by distance records I might as well buy a bucket of wraiths and really disappoint myself.

actually, you'de buy a bucket of valkryies ;)

i think a dx valk fairly beat in, requires an equal amount of power as a sidewinder. if a dx valk is super beat in, it will require even less power than a sidewinder. new they take more power than a sidewinder, though. and in champ plastic, maybe just a smidge more power...

swel304 wrote:also my local course is very wooded and Im tired of destroying dx discs so quickly. I have control drivers I can throw ok, Im looking for max D for wide open long shots.


my solution to throwing dx in a wooded course (which i do), is to throw drivers with thinner rims, beefier flight plates, and with rim stablizers... teebirds, eagles, cyclones, gazelles. they all hold up well with plenty of tree hits. valks hold up pretty good... but i only use 'em for max D, where trees is less of an issue.

not saying everyone should throw dx in the woods... but it's definitely possible, and not as crazy of an idea as most people make it out to be.
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Postby swel304 » Sat Sep 23, 2006 6:41 pm

I have a jls, and a polaris ls, they are pretty good, thats actually what I usually use for control drives (or my cyclone) as they go so straight. Should I just be trying to throw them harder or maybe with anyhyser? One reason I was considering the sidewinder is they are supposed to be good rollers discs for ppl who cant throw rollers (which is definitly me,though I think the maximizer I got as a mystery gift may solve that). I know its pretty common to rely on dx beat to a certain point but so far that hasnt worked out for me. It either takes more damage and doesnt fly right anymore or I lose it. Like my eagle for example, I only throw on non wooded holes, but I always manage to land it on something hard that damages it. I got it a little over a month ago and its already almost trashed. as my friend would say " I could fall in a barrel of nipples and come out sucking my thumb"
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Postby Amateur » Sat Sep 23, 2006 10:26 pm

My last long distance disc was a 165g X Avenger. I know I can't throw that yet. I could throw it straight, hyzer, and turn it over on cue. Unfortunately I can't throw it any longer than my 176g S Sabre. Which makes it pointless to carry for max D.

The LAST DX teebird I had lasted 8 holes. I just ripped it into a tree 50 feet away and it took a chunk out of my disc the size of my pinky nail. Throwing DX drivers is a no go for me. Gateway's S is barely holding up, some of my Sabres look horribly sick.

I've thrown Valkyries. The Pro ones were mad flippy after 2 weeks, and the DX were meat after 2 weeks. All the DX Valkyries I've thrown have been different. I had one that was super flat and the rim seemed to curl more upwards. This was a fast (like 11) disc but I lost it in the woods after an errant throw. The rest of the Valkyries have been slower and less stable. I just flipped them over/had no accuracy (only sloppy D) with any.

I can accurately throw my Sabre 300ft. 8/10 throws with my Sabre within 10 feet of any other disc (often further), my Buzzz 20 feet shorter than my Sabre, and my Wizard just as far as my Buzzz.


I think I need to quit buying shit and start throwing discs more :wink: .
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Postby Terrence » Sun Sep 24, 2006 12:31 am

I average 280-300' of flat ground golf distance. I'm being honest, there's no message board inflation here :wink:

I throw DX and Pro Valks for max distance, and have recently been tossing a 167g Champ Sidewinder here and there. I also find it to be inconsistant; sometimes it'll hold a beautifuly long hyzer, some times it'll flip and never flex back.

I know i'll be sticking with my DX Valkyries in various stages of wear and weights for drives.
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Postby didihitatree » Sun Sep 24, 2006 12:50 am

swel304 wrote:that makes no difference to someone like me who is just trying to break 300 consitantly.


IMHO, if you can't break 300' consistently, the Sidewinder is not the disc for you. Star plastic and champion plastic is too overstable for anyone at that level no matter the disc. I bought one about three months ago when I was right around 300' and found that I could get good straight distance with it. Sometimes. And it needed a lot of room to go right and then fade left at the end.

I can throw 325' now on any semi-open hole and can throw a semi-beat up Avenger on a rope in a 20 foot corridor that distance. Still can't do that with a Sidewinder.

Amateur, have you tried an XL or Tracker? I could throw either an XL or a Tracker farther than I could throw my Avenger X for a long time. The Tracker really is like a longer Buzz. It's a bit more stable, like you'd expect from a driver-- but predictably so. I don't understand why it's not more popular.

The Discraft X plastic to me is a little less overstable than Champ and feels better than Pro. It also wears in a lot better. I went out and invested some money in discs so I can do the "3-4 of each model and rotate discs" thing now. But before that, I threw all Discraft X. If you play wooded courses and throw one DX disc as your primary driver, they definitely wear in too fast.
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Postby Thatdirtykid » Sun Sep 24, 2006 2:08 am

Amateur wrote:
some of my Sabres look horribly sick.

.


do they still fly well? I really liked my 886's beat.

If you want an out of the box understable premium plastic max D driver and the JLS is too stable, the sidewinder is your best choice. I just dont think premium plastics are as predictable for max d discs, or understable discs, much less both in one, and there are discs that fly worse.
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Postby swel304 » Sun Sep 24, 2006 5:26 pm

I cant throw ce plastic too well but I think its because it has almost no grip. I really like discraft X plastic, I think thats why I was so interested in star when I saw it. I had a ce leopard that I couldnt turn over even with tons of annie, but the star leopard I got is only slightly more overstable than my dx, and turns pretty consistantly. I hate to dissappointing anyone but I picked up the *SW today and it did exactly what I had hoped, pared all my nemesis 400+ holes with no trouble. I can see the lack of accuracy but its not too bad, and I think alot of that has to do with it not being effective in any type of wind. But as long as I have some room to breath on the left and right, it glides significantly past all my other drives. In fact in two rounds today I shot my two lowest scores ever. I did take the valk with me today and was suprised how well I can throw it now (havent tried it in a while) but it still only goes about as far as my jls and needs to be thrown way right to compensate for the fade. I think another thing that helped my score was giving up on the ever-changing dx eagle and using the jls/ls for my main driver today on the 150-250 holes. The jls seems to do pretty good in a headwind also.
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Postby Thatdirtykid » Sun Sep 24, 2006 9:30 pm

assuming the valk is DX plastic, it will loose that fade with age, and become easier to throw long. I am glad the sidewinder is working out for you, I hope it continues to do so while it breaks in.
Having everyone here online to talk about is great for opinions, but getting out there and finding what works for you is important.
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Postby disc_golfing_fool » Mon Sep 25, 2006 8:53 am

swel304 wrote:...using the jls/ls for my main driver today on the 150-250 holes. The jls seems to do pretty good in a headwind also.


For giggles, you should try your midranges/putters on holes of this distance (150-250 ft.). You may be surprised at their distance, and they are MUCH more controllable. If you can't do it at first, keep trying. Its worth the effort to learn.

Happy Hucking!

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Postby Thatdirtykid » Mon Sep 25, 2006 9:06 am

^^^^ very true ^^^^

one of the points I mark as a turning point is when I found out I could throw a roc 225. Now I am throwing a wizard 250, or 300 with the right elevation or wind.
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Postby superq » Mon Sep 25, 2006 9:30 am

NO

Couldnt resist sorry 8)
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Postby Thatdirtykid » Mon Sep 25, 2006 9:39 am

lol, I am getting this strange feeling I dont think hes going to listen to us :?



:roll:
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Postby Amateur » Mon Sep 25, 2006 10:00 am

Actually I just bought an Elite X XS. I had one in Elite Z (my first discraft disc) and I loved it and lost it. It was the most beat up premium plastic disc you'd ever see. I honestly don't know why I didnt buy another one right away. Had to expirament I guess? EDIT:Just remembered I had a max wt X XS for like 2 days, I just only threw the Z! Damn you lake Zureicher!

I was reading the reviews again for the millionth time and everyone's synopsis is the Elite X goes way farther. So I bought 2 at 165g. My Z was 171g. Hopefully this will get me some more D than the stupid fast drivers I've been trying, or my Sabres for that matter. I just know I can whip those discs.

Discraft's X plastic is my favorite now that I've had several. They all broke in for more D so far, the Predator especially.

Fear not Dirty. I am listening to you guys, but everybody is different. And yes my Sabres do fly very nicely still, they just look homely. I need to get some fresh ones soon. Maybe Evolution plastic? You've had both right Dirty? If you read this hook a brother up with a short review?
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