Why the lack of light-weight discs?

Golf Discs, Bags, Baskets, Videos, and other Disc Golf Related Equipment

Moderators: Timko, Solty, Frank Delicious, Blake_T, Fritz, Booter

Why the lack of light-weight discs?

Postby OldTyme » Fri Jul 28, 2006 4:58 pm

I was wondering about this so I thought I'd post & hope too get a good answer. : )

I recently discovered how great lightweight discs are. My 150 Star Valk is by far my farthest disc followed closely by my 158 Champ Sidewinder.

I was hoping too find a bit heavier Star Valk.....around a 155-158. Problem is they aren't made. They go from 150g to 167g+.
So I was hoping too find a 155g-160 Champ Valk. Again. Haven't had any luck.

Where are the middle weight discs??


I never throw my 158g Sidewinder anywhere it may get lost as I know the replacement would be near impossible anymore. No one seems too have them. (well I found discsunlimited.net has them but not the Valk)


So. Is there a reason they don't make them.
For me 150g is just a tad too light & 167+ is too much.
OldTyme
Tree Magnet
User avatar
 
Posts: 175
Joined: Fri May 20, 2005 5:24 am
Location: Mishawaka, IN

Postby Blake_T » Fri Jul 28, 2006 5:14 pm

any disc marked 150 is generally 155-159g.

discs marked 144-149g are usually pretty accurate.

the reason why there aren't more tweener weight discs:
they sell very poorly in the greater scheme of things.
Blake_T
Super Sekret Technique Jedi
 
Posts: 5824
Joined: Mon May 31, 2004 12:44 am
Location: Minneapolis

Postby adamschneider » Sat Jul 29, 2006 2:08 am

I've often wondered the same thing, and I don't completely buy the "they don't sell" argument; if that was the case, why do they bother selling 150s in the U.S.? The massive gap between 150 and 167 is perplexing.

My solution, for what it's worth: I set up an eBay auto-search that sends me an e-mail whenever there's a new item for sale whose name includes "Innova" and "158g," "159g", etc., up to 163g. Just the other day I snagged a 162g Champ Orc that way. (And if you can get them from a guy on eBay named "frisbeerancher," he only charges $1.50 for shipping.)
adamschneider
Fairway Surgeon
User avatar
 
Posts: 692
Joined: Tue May 30, 2006 2:13 am
Location: Portland, OR
Favorite Disc: 164g Halo

lightweight discs

Postby twmccoy » Sat Jul 29, 2006 5:49 pm

Lightweight discs are out there, and I seem to find lots of them. Just today I found 2 150g. champ teebirds and a 162g. champ sidewinder, as well as a couple 150g. champ valks. I even found a 144g. leopard. Imagine trying to keep that on a line. Keep an eye out at the local retailers and you will spot some light discs.
twmccoy
Plastic Fondler
 
Posts: 2168
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 11:07 pm
Location: Littleton, CO

Postby OldTyme » Sun Jul 30, 2006 4:47 am

Guess I should of titled this "Why the lack of tweener discs" 8)
I know the 150gs are readily available in a lot of molds.
It's the 150+ to 160 that are hard too find.
If indeed most 150 discs are 155-160 then I wish they'd label them as such.
Are the disc golf manufactuers that "busy" that they don't have time too properly weigh & label their discs?? If it's 155g then label it 155g....not 150.

I'm always keeping an eye out on ebay for them & definitely know about the frisbeerancher.

After I lost my 150g Star Teebird I knew I wanted something a bit heavier.
Luckily I did find a 155g Champ Teebird & it was everything I hoped it would be.

Now I think about it. I DO have a 155 Champ Valk I put away because it was an awful color & very hard too see. (bad tye job)
Guess if I want my tweener Valk I'm going too have too deal with it.
OldTyme
Tree Magnet
User avatar
 
Posts: 175
Joined: Fri May 20, 2005 5:24 am
Location: Mishawaka, IN

Postby Thatdirtykid » Sun Jul 30, 2006 11:20 am

150 discs sell better, because most people who want that light go straight to 150. Many courses (and all of japan) are -150g discs and a disc marked heavier would not be allowed.
Z Pred-ESP Cyclone-Z Force-Z Aftershock-Z Comet-Ion-Pro Rhyno
Thatdirtykid
Disc Whore
User avatar
 
Posts: 3673
Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2005 12:35 am
Location: Longmont Co
Favorite Disc: z pred

Postby adamschneider » Sun Jul 30, 2006 11:43 am

OldTyme wrote:If indeed most 150 discs are 155-160 then I wish they'd label them as such.

For the record, all of the discs I have that are labeled "150" are in fact between 148g and 150g.

(My favorite driver lately is my 160g Starfire, and I'm looking forward to that 162g Champ Orc...)
adamschneider
Fairway Surgeon
User avatar
 
Posts: 692
Joined: Tue May 30, 2006 2:13 am
Location: Portland, OR
Favorite Disc: 164g Halo

Postby Blake_T » Sun Jul 30, 2006 1:37 pm

and I don't completely buy the "they don't sell" argument


then you don't have a lot of knowledge/experience in disc sales.

standard weight discs (145-150g, 165-max) outsell tweeners by about 50:1.

according to rules of economics, they shouldn't even make tweeners due to the lost opportunity cost of not making a standard weight disc. they DO make them, but in much smaller quantities than that ratio, probably closer to 500:1.

i might have a real opinion on this, but i've found that about 95% of the people calling for tweener weights are people that are throwing the wrong discs for where they are on the learning curve.

if any of these people were asking for a 160g roc, gazelle, cheetah, eagle, teebird, cyclone, etc. i'd see a case for it. but no, they are asking for 160g orcs, beasts, starfires, wraiths, etc. and throwing less than 325'.

there are some target demographics for tweener discs, but they generally make up less than 2% of disc golfers. since production is driven by demand, there likely won't be more of these discs until that demographic pushes closer to 10%.

i've weighed a ton of stacks of champ/star tweener discs and most of them are about 5g heavier than marked.
Blake_T
Super Sekret Technique Jedi
 
Posts: 5824
Joined: Mon May 31, 2004 12:44 am
Location: Minneapolis

Postby adamschneider » Sun Jul 30, 2006 6:09 pm

Blake_T wrote:standard weight discs (145-150g, 165-max) outsell tweeners by about 50:1.

But the vast majority of the world's inventory of sub-165g discs is 145-150g. It becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy, as it's easy to sell 50x more of an available disc than one that's never in stock! I wonder what would happen if the entire range were widely available?
adamschneider
Fairway Surgeon
User avatar
 
Posts: 692
Joined: Tue May 30, 2006 2:13 am
Location: Portland, OR
Favorite Disc: 164g Halo

Postby Blake_T » Sun Jul 30, 2006 8:11 pm

i consider 145-150g to be standard weight.

most players are rec players. most rec players want heavy discs.

155-162g discs tend to just sit on shelves. i know this through experience.

you are barking up the wrong tree for several reasons:
1) if there truly was the demand, then stores would be ordering these discs from the manufacturers. if the manufacturers got an increasingly large demand for these discs, they would make more of them. result: they don't make very many of them, because there is very little demand for them. 3-5 of these per month is not significant demand.

2) i preach fundamentals. lighter discs are not a substitute for technique. if you are an adult male under the age of 40 AND throwing discs that fly within the speed range you can consistently generate, then you have no need for tweener weight discs unless you try to throw plastic that is OUTSIDE the speed range you can consistently generate. result: throw slower plastic until your technique is good enough to power the faster discs. i make similar comments on discs that are fast but very understable/unpredictable.

3) like seriously, look at 1 and 2.
Blake_T
Super Sekret Technique Jedi
 
Posts: 5824
Joined: Mon May 31, 2004 12:44 am
Location: Minneapolis

light discs

Postby twmccoy » Sun Jul 30, 2006 10:33 pm

I find enough discs in lakes to know that there must be at least some demand for 145-160g discs. I find tons of eagles, sharks, valks etc in light weights. Even the 155-165 weight class is becoming more popular.

I was at Wal mart today and noticed that almost all of their drivers were in the 157-167 range. Heavy plastic seems to be falling out of favor among stores that sell mainly to beginners. On a side note, innova seems to make far more lighter discs than discraft. I almost never find any discraft models (drivers) under 170g.
twmccoy
Plastic Fondler
 
Posts: 2168
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 11:07 pm
Location: Littleton, CO

Postby coogs » Wed Aug 02, 2006 7:00 pm

I recently found a 149g DX Valkyrie on my home course, after reading this thread does this mean I probably should've left it where it lay or does a disc that light have any practical implications for people that are not sacrificing technique for weight?
coogs
Tree Magnet
 
Posts: 119
Joined: Wed May 31, 2006 6:45 am


Return to Equipment

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], Google [Bot] and 2 guests