Champ and star teebird throws

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Champ and star teebird throws

Postby Aaron_D » Mon Nov 24, 2008 6:51 pm

I put up a new vid of 2 star and champ teebird throws.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gc5ciYo_kt8

Critiques are welcome and encouraged.
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Re: Champ and star teebird throws

Postby Bradley Walker » Mon Nov 24, 2008 7:25 pm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJyq5xvBS0w&feature=related

Aaron, the guy you need to watch is Garrett Gurthie. Look at :56 seconds in. Your throw is similar enough to his to be able to make distinctions.

Watch his hand speed and the disc speed.

Then watch yours.

Your hand speed is faster than his, yet the disc is not going nearly as fast. In fact, the disc appears to be getting about 40-50% of the speed of your hand?

Why?

PS; Would it be possible to put his throw in split screen with yours?
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Re: Champ and star teebird throws

Postby masterbeato » Mon Nov 24, 2008 11:12 pm

Your speed ceases to amaze me.

Very particular form indeed! - Scottish Accent

I agree with Bradley 100% is to keep your eye on GG. Seems like your putting those TB's past 425'? maybe even 440'?
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Re: Champ and star teebird throws

Postby JR » Tue Nov 25, 2008 1:27 am

Your left leg ain't nearly as straight as it could be at the knee at the time of the release. Try retarding the onset of the hip twist and subsequent actions a bit so that the knee straightens just after the disc leaves for maximum rate of acceleration just after the hit. Currently you're not utilizing the tremendous arm speed of yours like the others said. As you uncock the wrist squeeze harder especially with the index finger and thumb. You could also try different grips to try to maximize your grip strength to eliminate the slight but oh so important early slip.

Your left leg push is powerful and it does twist your hips by momentum but I think you could gain some power by trying to twist the hips harder. Explosively. Generally people gain muscle coordination ability before real muscle strength when starting to practice. I think you have previous practice so it may not last the usual three months of a beginner to start gaining muscle power. Currently I believe your hip twist control ain't the best your nervous system and muscle power can provide. So that's a good goal for conscious monitoring and attention focus. With these changes you should gain major D. The proof lies in GG's arm speed vs yours. You are the clear winner and GG is a D champ. Not too shabby from you :-D

Like I've said before I truly believe you have a 500' throw in you. GG throws farther with less input from the arm for linear portion of the arm swing. Timing may be an issue. Consider that if GG starts from a slower arm speed than you and ends up with less arm speed but gets a larger acceleration late in the throw he may still be generating more force than you. Especially the kind that spins the disc faster. Which makes all the difference. To eliminate that as a possible difference between you a later acceleration and a tighter grip late in the throw should help you in bringing up your spin rate to his level. It's just polishing the slightest final details for you. Perhaps finger power training could help you too.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: Champ and star teebird throws

Postby Bradley Walker » Tue Nov 25, 2008 8:26 am

It is Smash Factor (hand to disc transfer) thing.

If you could improve your Smash even 5% you would pick up 20 feet. Every 5%=20 feet.

Everything else is way down on the list.
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Re: Champ and star teebird throws

Postby Blake_T » Tue Nov 25, 2008 9:52 am

aaron:

i just briefly watched this yesterday once through. guessing those throws were in the 410-420' range?

your elbow is still late getting through... lagging about 6" behind. may want to try setting your right foot down with your elbow more forward than it is.

basically, that's the only thing holding you back from hitting the crap out of it. your arm position is just a bit behind, not letting you get out in front of it.
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Re: Champ and star teebird throws

Postby Aaron_D » Tue Nov 25, 2008 10:28 am

Thanks all. I will keep working on it. I love you guys.
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Re: Champ and star teebird throws

Postby Bradley Walker » Tue Nov 25, 2008 11:31 am

If you

DID: You did get your elbow in front (gosh, I wonder where I heard that before?)

THEN: You could bare down more with your thumb lock and really get a hold of the disc at the rip (SMASH).

BECAUSE: The line of the release will be hinging from the lead elbow positioned to the LEFT. The arc of the arm hinge is left. This creates a PUSH to the left. THIS ALLOWS YOU GRIP EVEN HARDER FOR A HARDER RIP. Effectively allowing a later rip to get the disc on line.

BECAUSE: The disc must swinging INSIDE TO OUT from your chest.

BECAUSE: With a shallow elbow angle you are actually swinging to the right, and must actually SLIP the disc OR RELEASE EARLY to throw it straight.

Instead of just thinking "elbow front" you might try practicing throwing "inside to out" to create a PUSH to the left.

Instead of chopping to 2 o'clock you need to chop to 9:30. Look at Robbie Bratten in that video. That is an exaggerated push.
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Re: Champ and star teebird throws

Postby Aaron_D » Tue Nov 25, 2008 11:34 am

I see what your saying. Youre explanaitions are awesome. Thanks Brad.
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Re: Champ and star teebird throws

Postby Bradley Walker » Tue Nov 25, 2008 11:55 am

Blake is awesome. I am a truly humble student of the Obi Wan Blakobi that is all.

I will make one more recommendation.

Take the winter and learn to start your swing at the hit position.

Look at nearly ALL of the best players. Not all but most. Shultz, Doss, Feldberg, Jenkins, etc. There are lots more. They run up and place the disc in the hit position at 10 oclock and THEN SWING BACK FROM THERE. Then they swing back and hit it at that spot.

I believe your "arm back" run up promotes your poor elbow and hit position.

1. Start with the disc out in front of your chest
2. Cock forward (at the x step) and place the disc where you are going to hit, and get your elbow extended out in front (I mean extended----look at Garret Guthrie)
3. COCK BACK from there (wind up using trunk and shoulder muscles)
4. Rebound forward (glide forward with momentum)
5. Go right back through that position and hit the SHIT OUT OF IT!!!! (pull hard through using muscle-you already know how to do this better than anyone I know)

This is something I am learning myself, and it is a very powerful tool from "pre programming" the perfect hit position. It makes total sense, really.

You do not swing a golf club like Happy Gilmore and run up swinging back, you start from the ball. Swing back then forward to the same spot.

This is more than a positional thing. It is timing thing too. It is real confidence builder. However, it will screw with your form and timing until you get used to it. You will be all over the place. Trust me. I have been really having trouble because I am used to using my off arm a lot late in the throw. I realize now how bad this is screwing my potential. I "place" I do not "swing".

Take few months and learn it.
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Re: Champ and star teebird throws

Postby Bradley Walker » Tue Nov 25, 2008 12:00 pm

You are hitting foul ticks clean out the park.

God help us all if you actually hit the bat.
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Re: Champ and star teebird throws

Postby rodman20 » Tue Nov 25, 2008 6:57 pm

Aaron is that field on Pecan Dr? I live west towards mission.
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Re: Champ and star teebird throws

Postby Aaron_D » Tue Nov 25, 2008 7:01 pm

its right off trimble. its a great place to throw and like 1 mile from my house.
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Re: Champ and star teebird throws

Postby rodman20 » Tue Nov 25, 2008 7:13 pm

nice, ill have to give it a try, i usually go to the baseball fields down by TCC.
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Re: Champ and star teebird throws

Postby JR » Thu Nov 27, 2008 7:59 am

Bradley Walker wrote:You are hitting foul ticks clean out the park.

God help us all if you actually hit the bat.


I don't think anyone except perhaps Aaron himself doubts that sometime soon he will. And then we except the biggest guns here can put :mrgreen: in their signatures :-) On the other hand you probably won't need to once you heal your back and get the final adjustments down.

I second everything Bradley said.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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