OAT

[mpac]

this may be a dumb question i should know, but when you guys say OAT, what does that mean? is it in regards to lighter discs thrown to hard? flipping over?

[Timko]

Off axis torque. So changing the plane of your hips, shoulders, elbow, or wrist off of the "pure" throw plane in order to induce torque. When learning how to throw correctly, people need to aim to remove as much off axis torque as possible. It should be noted that if you know how to control OAT, you can shape a lot of shots.

[ChrisWoj]

Okay - I've been trying to figure this out for months. People seem to apply the phrase "OAT" to a lot of different things - can someone give a better explanation than the one above, which makes minimal sense? Right now it just seems to be a catch-all term to use for anything someone is doing wrong. Every time someone says they're doing something wrong on here, someone else says it must be an issue with "OAT." It feels like an inside joke, at this point.

I'm sure it has some distinct definition, but I'm not picking up on what it is.

ps - the search function is giving me an SQL error.

[Timko]

I don't know how my answer is unclear, so I'll try again.

Let's first talk about what "on plane means." Imagine you're throwing the disc flat. You rotate your body around an axis when you throw, similar to how a figure skater spins. So to be "on plane", your hips, shoulders, arm, and disc must rotate around this plane on the same angle.

ANYTHING getting off these planes is off axis torque. Not all OAT is bad, as long as you know how to control it. Most people that throw for big D have controllable OAT in their throw.

Some causes of OAT.

1. Jamming your hip (not following through with your hips)
2. Shoulder plane different than disc release plane
3. Pulling up or down on the elbow during the throw
4. Wrist Roll

[ChrisWoj]

So - it really is a broad catch-all phrase for most anything that could be jamming up your throw. I thought it was something more specific.

The big problem with your initial explanation was that it didn't at all explain what you considered a "pure throw plane." It also used OAT to define OAT repeatedly - your second explanation went into what made OAT and didn't just use the phrase to define itself. If someone doesn't know what OAT is to begin with, it isn't going to help him when you do that.

Thanks for the second explanation, it cleared things up nicely. Appreciated.

[Timko]

Chris, just curious, but what did you do get get kicked off the pdga board? I was looking through the diciplinary actions, and you and another guy got suspended for 6 months.

[Leopard]

how's this... OAT is commonly used here as a diagnosis, but it's more of a symptom that's common to a number of throwing errors. easily misunderstood distinction for posters and readers.

without the data of a video or personal observation, diagnosing the OAT is almost as far as we can go.

[garublador]

Off axis torque is any torque applied to the disc that's about an axis other than the one perpendicular to the flight plate of the disc. Torque applied to the disc about the axis perpendicular to the flight plate will cause the disc to spin like you'd expect a disc to spin. Torque applied on an axis that's parallel to the flight plate will cause the disc to tumble end over end.

Imagine you put a skewer through a disc and pointed that skewer at your target and that you're a RHBH thrower. If you push the right (anhyzer) it will spin end over end. That's the type of OAT we're normally talking about. Because there is a lot of "on axis torque" the disc is spinning as intended and has angular momentum opposing the tumbling. However, if that OAT is large enough it can still push left side of the disc upward causing a more understable flight than intended. That type of OAT can be caused by the stuff the other people mentioned.

Hopefully that clears it up a bit and doesn't have too many errors.

[ChrisWoj]

Chris, just curious, but what did you do get get kicked off the pdga board? I was looking through the diciplinary actions, and you and another guy got suspended for 6 months.

I'm not suspended from the PDGA Board from what I can see. Apparently my 3-month suspension from playing in PDGA events started on January 7th. Thats as a result of me getting in a fight at a tournament in October (the PDGA - always quick to get things done). Oh well - I'm missing 3 months during which time I'll be unable to play any tournaments anyway because I moved for a seasonal job, lol. I have a six month probation after that, but I'm not too worried about that.


-Chris.

[Mixed Bag Madness]

Chris, just curious, but what did you do get get kicked off the pdga board? I was looking through the diciplinary actions, and you and another guy got suspended for 6 months.

I'm not suspended from the PDGA Board from what I can see. Apparently my 3-month suspension from playing in PDGA events started on January 7th. Thats as a result of me getting in a fight at a tournament in October (the PDGA - always quick to get things done). Oh well - I'm missing 3 months during which time I'll be unable to play any tournaments anyway because I moved for a seasonal job, lol. I have a six month probation after that, but I'm not too worried about that.


-Chris.

I've always been curious about situations like this. How does something like this come about? I've always figured there has to be certain instances where people don't know when to shut it and you have to be on their card. I've heard numerous stories in Oregon about people wanting to absolutely kill Borg before he settled down. This is why I'm going to go the Barry route and wear headphones during future tourney play.(hopefully it will help some?)

[ChrisWoj]

Chris, just curious, but what did you do get get kicked off the pdga board? I was looking through the diciplinary actions, and you and another guy got suspended for 6 months.

I'm not suspended from the PDGA Board from what I can see. Apparently my 3-month suspension from playing in PDGA events started on January 7th. Thats as a result of me getting in a fight at a tournament in October (the PDGA - always quick to get things done). Oh well - I'm missing 3 months during which time I'll be unable to play any tournaments anyway because I moved for a seasonal job, lol. I have a six month probation after that, but I'm not too worried about that.


-Chris.

I've always been curious about situations like this. How does something like this come about? I've always figured there has to be certain instances where people don't know when to shut it and you have to be on their card. I've heard numerous stories in Oregon about people wanting to absolutely kill Borg before he settled down. This is why I'm going to go the Barry route and wear headphones during future tourney play.(hopefully it will help some?)

It was post tournament. I screwed up two holes on our card during the second round. The mistakes were caught and fixed but some am2 guy wouldn't stop heckling me (calling me a cheater - odd since my mistake helped the entire card, guys I was competing against, not me in particular), a friend of one of the guys I was golfing with. I told him to shut the f up, he told me to say it to his face. I walked up and said it to his face. Things escalated, some shoving, and thats the way things went. So.. yep. I had no issue with the guys on my card, though I just recently found out it was one of the guys on my card that got his buddy to get in my face for him since he was pissed. *eye roll*

Everybody screws up. I have a reputation for catching it when people make mistakes in my favor locally. I've done it at leagues and in tournament play. I also have a reputation for being really bad at handling the scorecard. But, it is what it is. I just maintain one fact: I do not steal money from my friends.