Snap 2009 (NEW video added)

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Re: Snap 2009 (NEW video added)

Postby Star Shark » Wed Apr 28, 2010 3:17 pm

Sort of. This is what blake calls Palm Ejection. It's very useful on putts but I dunno if that's what you're after on drives.
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Re: Snap 2009 (NEW video added)

Postby Banjar » Wed Apr 28, 2010 4:02 pm

Animix wrote:Sort of. This is what blake calls Palm Ejection. It's very useful on putts but I dunno if that's what you're after on drives.


No i don't think this is the same same thing as the Palm Ejection in putting with the putter bouncing of the palm. I'm not pushing the driver forward, I'm pulling into my hand so they collide right before the release. The more I think about it, I think I might be doing something right, but I would like to get that confirmed..
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Re: Snap 2009 (NEW video added)

Postby Bradley Walker » Wed Apr 28, 2010 8:42 pm

Banjar wrote:I have a question:

On and off for the last month or so, I've sometimes let my grip get very loose. Almost to the point of the disc not even resting in the palm when I pull, but just hanging on my fingertips, following the palm of my hand by about an inch or less. When I do that, I feel... something. The edge of my disc bangs into my palm and rolls out of my hand hinging in the fingertip(s). I've tried to illustrate it.

Image

Is this tendon bounce? Subjectively, it feels like the disc spins faster when it flies and behaves differently, but I'm not getting any significant distance increase (average D around 275-300 feet).

Also, when I hold the disc in the regular powergrip (pushing the rim into my palm with 4 fingers ), I dont feel the hit in my hand, and I'm wondering if I'm gripping too tight? With the loose disc I'm not getting very far around the disc during the pull (around 2 o-clock for me as lefty = 10 o'clock for you guys), and with the tighter grip, I dont feel it. I cant really seem to find an in between.

/Kristian


Take the last picture and move the elbow rearward and to the right instead of toward the target. The elbow must arc around the head, If you can get the weight of the disc aft of the wrist and hyper snap the elbow to the rear or the side, the wrist will explode ON TOP OF THE hammer throw aspect.

Moving the elbow too far forward too long results in a hyper extended elbow. Not necessary, and not good. The elbow barely moves at the correct moment. You are looking for a 4 inch long window of wrist unload, the grip pressure must go up exponentially in this erea where the wrists is being bent back. The upper arm MUST circle naturally around the body. The wrist must attain an angle where it is literally locked at the rip, but the elbow must travel around the arc in a natural fashion. If you look at the elbow, it moves moves contrary to the wrist. The wrist is moving toward the target, the elbow is moving away. The whip is cracked, the lever of the weight of the back of the disc is released. Snap.
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Re: Snap 2009 (NEW video added)

Postby MrScoopa » Wed Apr 28, 2010 9:07 pm

Moving the elbow too far forward too long results in a hyper extended elbow. Not necessary, and not good. The elbow barely moves at the correct moment. You are looking for a 4 inch long window of wrist unload, the grip pressure must go up exponentially in this erea where the wrists is being bent back. The upper arm MUST circle naturally around the body. The wrist must attain an angle where it is literally locked at the rip, but the elbow must travel around the arc in a natural fashion. If you look at the elbow, it moves moves contrary to the wrist. The wrist is moving toward the target, the elbow is moving away. The whip is cracked, the lever of the weight of the back of the disc is released. Snap.


Beautifully put.

Sorry, trolling.
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Re: Snap 2009 (NEW video added)

Postby patdabunny » Thu Apr 29, 2010 11:02 am

Quick question, Bradley--I noticed today that when the disc ripped out of my hand, it ripped the hardest off my pinky. (I throw with the ring stacked on the pinky for strength using the power grip.) Is this robbing snap and power? As I wrote to you, I've made a massive jump, but I know I'm losing power somewhere else and this is the one thing I can clearly see that you point out in your video.

Thoughts? Should I stop stacking the ring/pinky and focus that energy on the thumb/index pinch? This hammer technique has added soooooooo much power and spin on my throws, it's not funny...it's amazing!

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Re: Snap 2009 (NEW video added)

Postby mark12b » Thu Apr 29, 2010 11:32 am

Image

Isn't part of the problem here that the disc should be moving toward the top of the image, not toward the right? If the chest is at the bottom of the image and it's supposed to be faced-up to the target at launch, then the way I read position 3 is that the disc is flying about 90 degrees right of where it's supposed to.
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Re: Snap 2009 (NEW video added)

Postby MrScoopa » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:16 pm

Quick question, Bradley--I noticed today that when the disc ripped out of my hand, it ripped the hardest off my pinky. (I throw with the ring stacked on the pinky for strength using the power grip.) Is this robbing snap and power? As I wrote to you, I've made a massive jump, but I know I'm losing power somewhere else and this is the one thing I can clearly see that you point out in your video.

Thoughts? Should I stop stacking the ring/pinky and focus that energy on the thumb/index pinch? This hammer technique has added soooooooo much power and spin on my throws, it's not funny...it's amazing!

Daniel


It should rip hardest off the pointer or middle finger depending on the grip. It is most definitely robbing you of power. It is a BIG slip. You are not pivoting the disc with the lock point of the grip if this is happening. Like Bradley said in his video the grip get progressively lighter.
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Re: Snap 2009 (NEW video added)

Postby patdabunny » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:30 pm

MrScoopa wrote:
Quick question, Bradley--I noticed today that when the disc ripped out of my hand, it ripped the hardest off my pinky. (I throw with the ring stacked on the pinky for strength using the power grip.) Is this robbing snap and power? As I wrote to you, I've made a massive jump, but I know I'm losing power somewhere else and this is the one thing I can clearly see that you point out in your video.

Thoughts? Should I stop stacking the ring/pinky and focus that energy on the thumb/index pinch? This hammer technique has added soooooooo much power and spin on my throws, it's not funny...it's amazing!

Daniel


It should rip hardest off the pointer or middle finger depending on the grip. It is most definitely robbing you of power. It is a BIG slip. You are not pivoting the disc with the lock point of the grip if this is happening. Like Bradley said in his video the grip get progressively lighter.


I will say that it was more like having a big rip off the pinky, smaller one off the middle finger, and then a slightly larger one than that off the index finger. I had originally gone to this stack grip to prevent premature release (this was years ago). Now I know much more... :oops:

Man, I wonder how much further I could throw if I corrected that, keeping in mind my latest jump! Now, how to correct it? Focus on grip strength? (I'm currently using the dynaflex powerball thingy.) Change grip? I might even try one like Bradley's (middle over index finger for strength). Ideas, anyone?
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Re: Snap 2009 (NEW video added)

Postby Bradley Walker » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:22 pm

mark12b wrote: If the chest is at the bottom of the image and it's supposed to be faced-up to the target at launch


I keep hearing that...

Almost no one does it and if they did it would be only dynamically. The shoulder must move away and to the right around the head... the disc travels forward. The longer the grip stays with the disc on its forward the greater the stored energy when the disc reaches the apex.
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Re: Snap 2009 (NEW video added)

Postby Bradley Walker » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:26 pm

drledford93 wrote:
MrScoopa wrote:
Quick question, Bradley--I noticed today that when the disc ripped out of my hand, it ripped the hardest off my pinky. (I throw with the ring stacked on the pinky for strength using the power grip.) Is this robbing snap and power? As I wrote to you, I've made a massive jump, but I know I'm losing power somewhere else and this is the one thing I can clearly see that you point out in your video.

Thoughts? Should I stop stacking the ring/pinky and focus that energy on the thumb/index pinch? This hammer technique has added soooooooo much power and spin on my throws, it's not funny...it's amazing!

Daniel


It should rip hardest off the pointer or middle finger depending on the grip. It is most definitely robbing you of power. It is a BIG slip. You are not pivoting the disc with the lock point of the grip if this is happening. Like Bradley said in his video the grip get progressively lighter.


I will say that it was more like having a big rip off the pinky, smaller one off the middle finger, and then a slightly larger one than that off the index finger. I had originally gone to this stack grip to prevent premature release (this was years ago). Now I know much more... :oops:

Man, I wonder how much further I could throw if I corrected that, keeping in mind my latest jump! Now, how to correct it? Focus on grip strength? (I'm currently using the dynaflex powerball thingy.) Change grip? I might even try one like Bradley's (middle over index finger for strength). Ideas, anyone?


Focus on the thumb locking to the index AND middle finger. Focus on the thumb bearing down. The finger pressure is static.
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Re: Snap 2009 (NEW video added)

Postby discspeed » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:46 pm

I rip off my pinky...but its not just my pinky. Its reinforced by my ring and middle fingers that are stacked on it. Then all three fingers (together as one) are also pushing up through the flight plate into the base of my thumb. Is that the type of grip you are talking about?
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Re: Snap 2009 (NEW video added)

Postby patdabunny » Thu Apr 29, 2010 2:00 pm

discspeed wrote:I rip off my pinky...but its not just my pinky. Its reinforced by my ring and middle fingers that are stacked on it. Then all three fingers (together as one) are also pushing up through the flight plate into the base of my thumb. Is that the type of grip you are talking about?


Yes, very similar. The only difference is my middle finger is on the rim, independent of the others. I might try stacking all of them. Hmm.
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Re: Snap 2009 (NEW video added)

Postby patdabunny » Thu Apr 29, 2010 2:05 pm

Bradley Walker wrote:Focus on the thumb locking to the index AND middle finger. Focus on the thumb bearing down. The finger pressure is static.


This is something I must work on. When I grip the disc, the pinky area feels REALLY tight (without bearing down), but my thumb and index finger grip, even bearing down, is not tight enough. As I said, I'm working on my grip strength. However, I must find another way around that.

Ah, I just noticed something--you said finger pressure is static. So, at the hit, you're ONLY increasing the thumb/index finger lock pressure? NOT the entire grip pressure? That may be part of my problem...

USAnarchy's grip (lining up the disc between the middle and ring fingers) led to a tighter grip, but that caused a bad blister on my palm.
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Re: Snap 2009 (NEW video added)

Postby Banjar » Thu Apr 29, 2010 2:20 pm

mark12b wrote:
Image

Isn't part of the problem here that the disc should be moving toward the top of the image, not toward the right? If the chest is at the bottom of the image and it's supposed to be faced-up to the target at launch, then the way I read position 3 is that the disc is flying about 90 degrees right of where it's supposed to.


Pardon my drawing skills..The positions are definitely off from what is optimal, which also goes for my form. I was not trying to make an accurate depiction of my body when i drew this, it was more to illustrate what I felt happening (very subjective). I think you are right though, for 1) chest is at the bottom, and 3, it is probably supposed to be perpendicular to the upper arm, and the velocity arrow on the disc should probably be pointing down at almost vertical.. but again, this is just a subjective drawing.


I went out again today and started to increase the tightness of the grip incrementally, while still feeling whatever it is I feel, and managed to get a fairly tight grip, which is good. The release is hurting my finger, though. The outermost digit, that wraps around the inside edge has a nasty blister now. The discs rip/slip out over this digit. So my question now is if I'm gripping it wrong? Do you snap the disc of the digit or of the fleshy tip (opposite the nail)? I think I'm using a fairly regular powergrip, so maybe this is just normal and my fingers arent used to it.
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Re: Snap 2009 (NEW video added)

Postby Redisculous » Thu Apr 29, 2010 2:52 pm

Your illustration is mostly correct, just take into consideration what Brad said about the elbow rotating further around in the last frame. The chest does face up, and in your illustration it would face up to the right, but when I throw (and I certainly don't bomb it but I can throw a roc 300' at the moment) I feel like my chest faces up only to allow my arm to finish properly.


Also, feeling the disc nudge/roll out of your palm has been mentioned on several occasions my Masterbeato, and is a good thing. I have been getting this recently, and when I do, I can feel my fingers stretching as the disc wants to pull itself from my grip. I believe this is when it is time to grip it hard/pull it back into your hand to get the slingshot around the lock point.
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