Jakes Drive Analysis

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Jakes Drive Analysis

Postby Jak3 » Tue Aug 03, 2010 9:56 am

Hey guys, i posted these over at DGCR but i was told i could get more pointers here.
Ive only been throwing RHBH for 2 months now, i average 310-335' maybe.

Main trouble areas what have already been said are: Bad timing, no forward weight transfer, disc isnt close enough to my nip.

Couple of those turned over on me, which is what im having the most trouble with lately. The good throws S'ed out at about 320-340'.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bau56MmquuQ


And heres where i was last week before i got some advice on DGCR. My weight is all on my back foot and my reach back is pretty weak.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JVj6CIK5efM

Let me know if you notice any improvement between the two.


Edit: o ya, and another thing someone pointed out to me today, I grab the disc with my left hand on the reach back.. I dont see pros doing this and maybe this is limiting my reach back since i cant reach back as far with both hands as i can with one... Correct me on this if need be.

Image

Image

Image
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Re: Jakes Drive Analysis

Postby Jeronimo » Tue Aug 03, 2010 11:17 am

Thats deceiving that you only threw that 320'-340'. I would have easily expected those to be 350'+ That all leads me to believe the key here might be to just grip harder (resist the disc ripping out of your hand). Definitely stop grabbing the disc with your left hand during reach back, its not a productive habit. That's the biggest thing I think I can point out, the others will tear the rest of you apart...
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Re: Jakes Drive Analysis

Postby Jak3 » Tue Aug 03, 2010 11:42 am

Thanks man, that would be awesome if all it came down to was grip heh.

I kinda do a 3 finger power grip with my pinky sitting on the rim but without much pressure. I gota nice callus on my index finder right above the first knuckle. Ill try to take a picture of my grip tonight.
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Re: Jakes Drive Analysis

Postby Jeronimo » Tue Aug 03, 2010 1:52 pm

When I say grip I mean less the placement of your fingers and more the amount of pinch strength you are exerting on the disc. 1st step to increase distance would be to get that pinky in there if possible. The disc should not be doing the lion share of it's pull on your index finger, the first point it should try to force its way out of would be your pinky/ring/middle finger stacked on each other to give them strength.
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Re: Jakes Drive Analysis

Postby Jak3 » Tue Aug 03, 2010 2:09 pm

ahh ic. Well the problem i have with the pinky is i have very small hands for a man.. Like, carny hands.

I have a hard time getting all my fingers around the rim sometimes. If i forcefully grip it with all 4 fingers it sits in the palm of my hand with almost a nose up type position.. Looks and feels funny. Ill experiment today at the field though. Most of my grib is index and middle finger it seems.

I thought it was a strange grip too until i seen this video of Marty Peters. Around 4:05. I actually put my pinky on the rim tho unlike that kid. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G-5uHMoYJ6Q


Ill try to hold it tigher too.
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Re: Jakes Drive Analysis

Postby Jeronimo » Tue Aug 03, 2010 2:14 pm

Tighter matters only when the disc is forcefully ejecting ITSELF from your grip, so you don't really have to do it until the last moment. The other thing you could try is to intentionally release the disc later than you normally would, don't try this around anything with O.B. as your shot will obviously go crazy, but it will probably fly farther than normal.
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Re: Jakes Drive Analysis

Postby Jak3 » Tue Aug 03, 2010 2:33 pm

Ya, someone mentioned i might be releasing too early.
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Re: Jakes Drive Analysis

Postby keltik » Tue Aug 03, 2010 10:19 pm

Jak3 wrote:Image

Image


these two pictures tell the whole story. you are definitely NOT getting your center of mass moving forward. also your right shoulder is too high meaning you are releasing nose up. this is also evidenced in the second photo. the nose up throwing (caused by your weight being back) causes the disc to stall in flight, which saws off a good bit of distance potential.

another thing that is holding you back is that you are not rotating your body/shoulders far enough away from the target.

I would advise working on getting your weight forward first. keep practicing with a slow controlled throwing motion but focus on throwing with your weight moving forward. remember stay slow and in control. once you get comfortable being forward then you can start addressing the issue of reach back. It's all a slow process. keep it up and enjoy yourself.
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Re: Jakes Drive Analysis

Postby Jak3 » Tue Aug 03, 2010 11:45 pm

Thanks alot, very informative.

Ive been struggling with the whole weight transfer thing. Its getting better though i think. If you watch my first video i lean backwards.. At least now its more centered.. Something about the whole learning forward thing feels awkward to me when i try it.

Should of pushing off my left foot a little onto my plant foot to get the weight forward? Bending my back?

Maybe its just a timing issue.
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Re: Jakes Drive Analysis

Postby JR » Wed Aug 04, 2010 5:31 am

Taking about 8" shorter final step will help with getting the weight forward. That may change your form and timing so another video would be helpful.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: Jakes Drive Analysis

Postby keltik » Wed Aug 04, 2010 11:04 am

JR is correct in that you do need to shorten your steps. slowing down your run up will help you shorten your steps. the awkwardness you feel in getting your weight forward is likely due to your muscles not being used to supporting your body weight in that position, meaning you feel off balance.

pushing off with your left foot, like a skateboard kick is the first part of the weight transfer. using a shortened step as JR mentioned provides more power to do this push/kick. this is also why you see a lot of big throwers finish their run up with more of a hop. you will land from a hop with your feet about shoulder width apart which is optimal for the push/kick. when you do a walk/run up heavily planting each step it is easier to over extend the final step.
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Re: Jakes Drive Analysis

Postby Jak3 » Wed Aug 04, 2010 11:35 am

Awesome Keltik. This makes alot of sense.

Seems like ive just been using the momentum of my swing too try and transfer the weight. This is probably one reason i strong arm.
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Re: Jakes Drive Analysis

Postby Jak3 » Thu Aug 05, 2010 6:55 pm

Ok so ive been putting alot of effort into shifting weight. This whole kick trick has help out tons. One draw back is it adds another thing you have to time perfectly.

Im pretty certain im getting my weight forward more because im throwing way lower and way straighter for the most part. Im also throwing more consistently meaning they are all landing in the same spot.

I knew right away when i started worm burning everything that something in my form changed.


Im still torquing stuff over a heck of alot BUT, one thing i did today and ive done it a few times before when this started happening. I drop my arm down a bit. I think im torquing everything over because my shoulder is in a anhyzer type position being way up high like in that picture. When i drop my arm down a bit and come threw more around or above the belly button area i feel like i can generate so much more power coming through that area. I think it also drops my shoulder down when i do that and i quit torquing everything over. The drawback from doing this is sometimes ill throw super hyzers. They still feel powerful as heck, way more powerful then my normal arm height which is probably in the neck area.

If i throw this way with my roadrunner especially i can throw it with a slight hyzer, the disc comes out on a hyzer, lifts up flat, turns right a little and comes back left smooth as butter. I believe this is called a Hyzer Flip?

If i try this method with my destroyer most of the time it just hyzers out big time. But i can do it pretty good with my roadrunner and beasts.

I believe the part of the throw im referring to is "the powerzone", where should i be coming through at? I gotta figure out a way to keep my shoulder down, you mentioned getting my weight forward would help with this but im still struggling.
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Re: Jakes Drive Analysis

Postby keltik » Thu Aug 05, 2010 8:28 pm

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=16139

read this; it's long but it is full of all the information you seek.

yes you have successfully discovered the hyzer flip. good job! as far as the destroyer replicating this action, it takes a lot of power for that to happen. or a really beat to snot destroyer. the hyzer flip is best performed with flippy drivers like the RoadRunner.
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Re: Jakes Drive Analysis

Postby JR » Thu Aug 05, 2010 10:34 pm

A Pro Destroyer will beat into hyzer flipper with good power. It's the longest variety of Destroyer and it remains in the sweet spot longer than DX plastic. Pro does wear reasonably fast for this nice state which is the longest usable state any kind of Destroyer is gonna become.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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