Distance Drives

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Re: Distance Drives

Postby emiller3 » Fri Mar 25, 2011 10:07 am

JR is right, you are swooping in the middle and its causing you to get hyzer even when your shoulder plane is parallel to the ground. And sometimes you are leaning into the throw quite a bit, which will cause even more hyzer (this is ok if you want to throw hyzer):

Image

To throw flat, keep your shoulder plane parallel to the ground and experiment with your pull line. Try pulling level at various heights (waist, stomach, chest). Experiment with more than just flat lines, also try starting out low and finishing at different heights. You need to exert some control over your arm while still keeping it loose, it's kind of flailing right now.

Slowing down the start of your pull will promote better timing, your acceleration is peaking a little too early. It also might make it easier to know what trajectory your arm is heading on.

You have the makings of good form, keep at it.
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Re: Distance Drives

Postby derfernerf » Fri Mar 25, 2011 1:16 pm

I can't believe nobody else noticed this...

You're throwing with the wrong hand....
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Re: Distance Drives

Postby fanter » Tue Mar 29, 2011 2:42 pm

I was hoping to keep that hidden!

Anyway, I've tweaked my throw a bit. I'll post a new video as soon as I can get my hands on a camera. I think I've figured out the "late acceleration" business, but I've only delayed my arm flail. My throws seem "easier," that is, longer with less effort, but I'm still quite sure that I'm scooping low with my arm. I don't think it's too far of a stretch to say that I have very little muscle control. I am not, and have never been, an athletic person.
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Re: Distance Drives

Postby fanter » Wed Mar 30, 2011 7:10 pm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sOkgAKwEVUI

I arrived at this form by trying to plant my foot before beginning my turn. I found after doing this that my throw became smoother and more controllable. I notice that I'm still not getting much "pull" in my arm. Maybe I should slow down? Try working from the hit backwards? It looks like I could get more out of my reachback, too.
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Re: Distance Drives

Postby Sean40474 » Wed Mar 30, 2011 7:58 pm

It seems like you could get your arm straighter on your reach back. It almost seems like you have a cross between a bent-elbow and reachback style throw.
It's all about discipline and focused practice!

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Re: Distance Drives

Postby JR » Thu Apr 28, 2011 6:35 am

I had missed this one completely being in Holland for dubs and filming the Dutch Open.

I'd call your execution speed and form control shot if it weren't for the run up steps before the x step. I don't think that run up gives you much advantage but it could very well put you at a disadvantage. You should be able to throw equally far with just the x step once you accelerate the arm harder. And move the legs faster with the x and the plant step. Your arm is moving at a fairly constant speed and fairly slowly. You need to get the arm moving fast so you should train that first train that from stand still concentrating on moving the arm as fast as possible.

The plant step is a foot too long for that speed so you shouldn't kick the right leg toward the target from the hip when your chest points 90 degrees left of the target.

Your arm is far away from the body all the time and it works for some because it is easier to snap harder when the muscles are looser but the angles to make the wrist snap fully are much more difficult to make happen. Because it takes much more power to get similar wrist snap when pulling away from the chest. The elbow should lead the rest of the am a nit further to get to the angles at the elbow and the wrist where the max snap happens. Right pec position and right pec drill are the usual starting points.

Your arm height at the reach back is the highest of the throw and you go lowest at the middle of the throw and release on an upward arm motion from that lowest point. That is why your disc rises fast and is nose up and probably semi or fully stalls high too early. If you keep the arm at a constant height you'll lower the apex of the flight and have the disc flying faster on average fading later and going farther. This is major and you really should train this a lot. There's a lot of D available from this change.

You don't generate a lot of power from the hips and the shoulders. They are at neutral position fairly quickly after the reach back but you don't really turn them to the left for added power and distance.

Your run up distance and plant step planting position are aligned for a flat shot but your arm moved mostly on hyzers. For a flat release you need to only correct the arm plane. For a hyzer throw the running direction should be rear right to front left and the plant position should move a little to the left according to the angle of the hyzer. Mild hyzer needs to move less to the left in the plant position and a steep hyzer more.

Can you stiffen the muscles in the left leg a little more so that you would pivot rotating to the left more instead of stepping forward?
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: Distance Drives

Postby Sean40474 » Thu Apr 28, 2011 10:04 am

It seems that your body is tad forward on release and you're losing some power. Also, your arm doesn't seem to be straight and parallel with the ground all the time. I did the same thing when I first started and I've noticed a distance gain by making my arm straighter and coming across my chest tight and on the plane of my shoulder. It seemed that once I got this down it lended itself to hitting harder and feeling the same sensation of the right pec drill.
It's all about discipline and focused practice!

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Re: Distance Drives

Postby fanter » Thu Apr 28, 2011 4:42 pm

Current situation: my practice field is a sinkhole and it's been raining for a week.

Thanks for the continued input, guys. I've been through some changes since I posted this video, but nothing significant enough for me to post a new one for critique. Good weather and the end of the spring semester will be a good chance for me to get in some more practice.
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Re: Distance Drives

Postby fanter » Thu Apr 28, 2011 6:55 pm

I might have just experienced something significant. Result: my left tricep is TIGHT.

I started with putters in a small field by my house. I exerted a sort of "pump" with my arm going into the throw, which basically gave me the feeling and control of moving the arm (instead of allowing it so sling around my body), which I then employed to PULL my arm through the throw. I had some freakish putter drives that sailed over a fence. not sure the distance, but it was a solid 30-40' more than my average putter drives). Things I noticed: greater control/accuracy, better distance. I was actually able to gather up all my putters within a 25' circle, which is new.

So I took some drivers out afterward (and moved to a different open area), and voila! My drives were moving faster and farther. However, the nose up issues that you all have mentioned were still there (and my discs were still generally going farther). Nose up fixers: wrist extension and weight forward, right?

I'm going to spend some more time with this and then I'll post a video.
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Re: Distance Drives

Postby Iman522 » Thu Apr 28, 2011 8:56 pm

So you already have loads of advice to keep in mind when practicing and your hopefully having some sort of a breakthrough. Just a couple things about nose up issues from my troubles. You can have wrist extension and weight forward and still have nose up if you have a poor grip. If your grip is good then definitely work on some wrist extension. Bradley's predator drill works well for that and even just becoming conscious of it while practicing will help. I wouldn't worry to much though about weight forward as in your videos you could tell you did have your weight forward.
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Re: Distance Drives

Postby JR » Fri Apr 29, 2011 9:50 am

Congratulations those are great results for such a short period of time!!!

Also pushing the wrist down actively about when or a little after elbow starts to straighten. Along with the constant altitude. Everyone is different so you should also try different arm pull heights to see where you can push the nose down the easiest. Overkill exercise would be to intentionally reach back high and release slow. Worm burner country. Thereafter you can lower the reach back or raise the rip point or both until you're at your best arm pull height.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: Distance Drives

Postby fanter » Mon Feb 06, 2012 6:53 pm



Here is a long video of me snapping a pair of boxers in my pajamas. I went with standstills this time so I could stay in the shot. I know that if I try a run up, a lot of body positions won't translate. Let me know what you see here, and I'll put up a full drive video in the next couple days.
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Re: Distance Drives

Postby fanter » Mon Feb 06, 2012 11:30 pm

Some basic info because I was in a rush earlier:

Drives are in the 400' range max. I don't drive anything faster than a Valkyrie/OLF because I don't snap the wide rims well.

For this video my stance is staggered, with my lead hip (left) "closed off" a little, with my foot at a ~45 degree angle from the target. I notice that sometimes my wrist orientation is just totally off, but I'm positive it's a result of not having a disc in my hand. I know I'm not getting a resounding pop (which may be because of the boxers) but I do feel like I'm getting wrist extension, which to me means that I'm not getting enough late acceleration.

My BIGGEST issue, though, which you will see later, is that even if I am getting some wrist extension, I never get the chance to engage it on a full drive. I can feel my drives slip early and my wrist basically extends once the disc is gone.
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Re: Distance Drives

Postby JR » Tue Feb 07, 2012 4:15 pm

I can't produce the kind of bang with a towel like the top pros do but your's is more of a woosh than a pop. Can't tell much about towel drills but you aren't turning the hips and the shoulders past neutral in the throw. Mirroring the reach back would be good with the hip twist and shoulder turn to the right. As it is you're not generating enough power there.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: Distance Drives

Postby fanter » Wed Feb 08, 2012 12:13 am

So...more twist at the hips? Point them more away from the target?

And when you say that I'm not turning my shoulders past neutral, is that in the reachback, or the follow through?
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