Dead duck disc

Information, Questions, Discussion about Throwing Mechanics and Technique

Moderators: Timko, Solty, Frank Delicious, Blake_T, Fritz, Booter

Dead duck disc

Postby Crosseyed0811 » Sat Sep 24, 2011 3:36 pm

I have made my case on these boards before as being a tunnel thrower and what ever. I picked up an Ion and a new Axis the other day and hit the field with them and my teebirds and leopards. I have been working on my throw recently, and I can tell I'm getting more snap a lot of the time, but I'm not getting any more distance. I'm getting frustrated. I'll list some approx distances based on the yard lines on the football field I was throwing on. These were probably a LITTLE longer because I was going by yard lines but the disc were not straight down the field, being off to the left or right depending on how it threw and I was dealing with decent headwind/tailwind depending on which way I was going on the field.

Ion: 190-200
Axis: 230-240
Teebird: 240-280

Now to my problem that I can see. When I throw a disc, I can see it go as far as it can go on just the momentum I give it, and then it dies. It goes into the fade portion of the flight and drops fading back to the left. It doesn't push forward at all. Its like the disc doesn't take over in its portion of the flight. The only time this does not come into play is on an anny with an understable disc, and those tend to carry farther for me. The Axis for example, was in the 230-240 range for me most of the time, except when I threw it on a good anny line about 10 ft or so off the ground and it carried out to around 275-280. Is it my discs still having too much fade to fly for me at my power level? Is it my technique? I have a sneaky suspicion that it is spin, which is part of why I wanted to try the MVP discs. I KNOW they want spin so I wanted to see how they flew and use them to judge when I get more spin on them. Does it sound like spin to you guys? How do you get more spin? ANY help appreciated...
Last edited by Crosseyed0811 on Mon Sep 26, 2011 12:52 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Crosseyed0811
Fairway Surgeon
 
Posts: 536
Joined: Wed Apr 06, 2011 1:02 pm
Location: Rock Hill, SC
Favorite Disc: Zero Hard Pure

Re: Dead duck disc

Postby MDP » Sat Sep 24, 2011 3:55 pm

Crosseyed0811 wrote:I have made my case on these boards before as being a tunnel thrower and what ever. I picked up an Ion and a new Axis the other day and hit the field with them and my teebirds and leopards. I have been working on my throw recently, and I can tell I'm getting more snap a lot of the time, but I'm not getting any more distance. I'm getting frustrated. I'll list some approx distances based on the yard lines on the football field I was throwing on. These were probably a LITTLE longer because I was going by yard lines but the disc were not straight down the field, being off to the left or right depending on how it threw and I was dealing with decent headwind/tailwind depending on which way I was going on the field.

Ion: 190-200
Axis: 230-240
Teebird: 240-280

Now to my problem that I can see. When I throw a disc, I can see it go as far as it can go on just the momentum I give it, and then it dies. It goes into the fade portion of the flight and drops fading back to the left. It doesn't push forward at all. Its like the disc doesn't take over in its portion of the flight. The only time this does not come into play is on an anny with an understable disc, and those tend to carry farther for me. The Axis for example, was in the 230-240 range for me most of the time, except when I threw it on a good anny line about 10 ft or so off the ground and it carried out to around 275-280. Is it my discs still having too much fade to fly for me at my power level? Is it my technique? I have a sneaky suspicion that it is spin, which is part of why I wanted to try the MVP discs. I KNOW they want spin so I wanted to see how they flew and use them to judge when I get more spin on them. Does it sound like spin to you guys? How do you get more spin? ANY help appreciated...


Sounds more like nose-up issues to me, since it sounds like it's stalling out (no forward fade).
PD2 | DD | PD | TD | MD2 | P2 | P1
MDP
Tree Magnet
 
Posts: 235
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2011 8:26 pm
Location: Iowa
Favorite Disc: PD

Re: Dead duck disc

Postby Crosseyed0811 » Sat Sep 24, 2011 4:19 pm

Hmm... that could be it too.. One reason I've always thrown line drives is because I don't seem to get the whole throw it higher with nose down or whatever...

Edit: Geeze, I was not even THINKING nose up. I keep my thumb out on the rim and I keep the disc flat or cocked nose down in my grip. Not sure what else to do?
Crosseyed0811
Fairway Surgeon
 
Posts: 536
Joined: Wed Apr 06, 2011 1:02 pm
Location: Rock Hill, SC
Favorite Disc: Zero Hard Pure

Re: Dead duck disc

Postby Crosseyed0811 » Sat Sep 24, 2011 5:56 pm

You have the wrong wrist angle for the disc pivot.
Possible Fix:
Disc pivot is a tricky one to explain but I will do my best. Newer players often think that the disc will leave your hand exactly as it is at the point of release. This is true if you are letting go of the disc, but a correct grip and throw will have the disc ripping out of your hand by pivoting off between your last finger on the rim and your thumb. You can simulate this by holding the disc with your grip and pulling it slowly out of your hand. Pause at the last place you find your hand touching and that is your disc pivot point. Notice how the disc lurches a little upwards and to the left. If you hold the disc "flat" as it enters the pivot, the resulting up/left lurch will pull the nose up slightly. To have the disc pivot off with a nose-down angle, you will want to either press the disc down lower at your pivot point or raise the back end up a little bit. Both should give the same result, they are just a different way of thinking about it. You can experiment with angle by simulating a disc pivot and with a little practice you should be able to find the angle that works best for you to keep the nose down.


Sneaky suspicion this could be the problem, not sure I understand it enough to fix it though but this sounds foreign enough to be something I don't feel like I'm doing...
Crosseyed0811
Fairway Surgeon
 
Posts: 536
Joined: Wed Apr 06, 2011 1:02 pm
Location: Rock Hill, SC
Favorite Disc: Zero Hard Pure

Re: Dead duck disc

Postby MDP » Sat Sep 24, 2011 7:05 pm

Nose-up issues are usually the result of either grip/wrist orientation or not getting your weight shifted forward enough. Both are hard to diagnose without a video.

For grip/wrist stuff. Make sure that your grip puts the disc parallel (or slightly nose down compared to parallel) to your arm. Your wrist should be in a similar position to how you would pour a pot of coffee.

If you think you already do that, make sure it's staying that way through your through. Starting off with correct wrist orientation won't help unless it stays that way to the hit.

If you think you're consistent with that, the next thing to check would be the weight shift. What does your follow throw look like? Do you rotate/spin on your plant foot or step through with your non-plant foot?
PD2 | DD | PD | TD | MD2 | P2 | P1
MDP
Tree Magnet
 
Posts: 235
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2011 8:26 pm
Location: Iowa
Favorite Disc: PD

Re: Dead duck disc

Postby Crosseyed0811 » Sat Sep 24, 2011 7:14 pm

MDP wrote:If you think you're consistent with that, the next thing to check would be the weight shift. What does your follow throw look like? Do you rotate/spin on your plant foot or step through with your non-plant foot?


Yes, used to have bad issues with this, basically throwing the disc way high... Fixed that.
Crosseyed0811
Fairway Surgeon
 
Posts: 536
Joined: Wed Apr 06, 2011 1:02 pm
Location: Rock Hill, SC
Favorite Disc: Zero Hard Pure

Re: Dead duck disc

Postby MDP » Sat Sep 24, 2011 9:05 pm

If you're confident it's not a weight shift issue the most likely cause is grip/wrist orientation. Again it's a tough to determine what the cause is without a video but the flight you've described is classic nose-up flight.

Other things it could be: bad pull line, simply not enough speed on the disc, wrist roll, bad follow through...

Or it could be a combination of things.
PD2 | DD | PD | TD | MD2 | P2 | P1
MDP
Tree Magnet
 
Posts: 235
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2011 8:26 pm
Location: Iowa
Favorite Disc: PD

Re: Dead duck disc

Postby Crosseyed0811 » Sat Sep 24, 2011 9:10 pm

Knowing that its nose down I may can get it figured out from there. Just really hadn't thought along those lines because I'm doing the things, or think I'm doing the things, to correct the "classic" nose up throws... I don't know that I get much disc pivot though to be honest... Its too quick for me to really tell but I feel like the disc pops out of the hand all at once rather than popping off the lock and pivoting before coming out. From what I understand that kills spin and causes nose up? Not sure how to fix this though...
Crosseyed0811
Fairway Surgeon
 
Posts: 536
Joined: Wed Apr 06, 2011 1:02 pm
Location: Rock Hill, SC
Favorite Disc: Zero Hard Pure


Return to Technique

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests