Axis of Evil

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Re: Axis of Evil

Postby discspeed » Sun Oct 02, 2011 11:00 am

JR wrote:
jubuttib wrote:@zj: That's why I still have the C-MD2 in my bag. The Axis is absolutely fantastic on finesse shots (and discspeed said that it's a new type of mid: It's a slightly improved version of the orange FR P-MD2's :) ) but I really like having a disc I can rip without worrying about it.


Axis and Ion are more sensitive to the release angle than most discs if you measure how far off sideways you land per a degree of miss in the hyzer angle.


I have to really think about this one...I think you may be right as the discs will hold exact lines a little more than most discs, but they also still push forward on whatever angle they fly on for me. I suspect this can also be manipulated by adjust the amount of forward momentum vs. spin on your throw because I think I do some of this only semi-consciously when I throw different lines. l know that I feel a pinpoint touch on the Ion and Axis that I don't or haven't with other similar discs, but I'm not always on with them. When I'm not exactly on though they are still fairly forgiving for me, I'm just not getting exactly what I visualize like I can at other times.
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Re: Axis of Evil

Postby discspeed » Sun Oct 02, 2011 11:10 am

I just got my first Axis ace this morning! It was a 261' downhill hole that you have to throw through a gap off the tee and then negotiate some pine trees to get to the basket. My shot was too straight, headed right for the basket, but also right for a tree that just barely takes away the straight line. If there were no trees there my shot would have hit the basket dead on, but I kissed the tree right in front of the basket. The shot was about to fade, so the tree hit just barely knocked it out to the right and it hyzered right back to it's line and into the chains.
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Re: Axis of Evil

Postby 7ontheline » Sun Oct 02, 2011 2:10 pm

My Axis seems easy to throw 250' stable straight tee shots without turn. However, I must have a mental block or weak tired grip issues because I had just as many early releases today as good shots. My failures occur when I'm trying to muscle it out there for distance on low ceiling drives. I reread several pages here and see others talking about throwing with touch and less than 100% power which is something I had to learn to do with my Comet. Right now I can't see getting anymore D with the Axis than I can get finessing the Comet. I've already gotten fair command of my Comet and it goes just a far, actually further because I have the confidence to hyzer flip it. I like the HSS appeal of the Axis for stable lines but really want the distance I got hucking my Buzzz. Don't get me wrong, if someone had handed me a Axis instead of the Comet and my release issues weren't what they currently are then the Axis might be my do almost everything under 300' disc right now.

Why should I learn this disc when its only going to be able to do the lines I've already have covered with my Comet? More practice? Move on, as in trade? :?
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Re: Axis of Evil

Postby discspeed » Sun Oct 02, 2011 4:12 pm

I don't know why, but when I was first warming up today I couldn't get the Axis going. I threw a 280' low ceiling hole 2 times with 2 different Axis and I didn't have a single good shot...I finally realized that I was trying to power them too much like a Buzzz. After that I gave them a bit more finesse and a slightly higher/nose neutral trajectory and parked both discs. From that point on I was good with them.
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Re: Axis of Evil

Postby Rogue9 » Sun Oct 02, 2011 9:05 pm

What do mean by more finesse?
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Re: Axis of Evil

Postby JR » Mon Oct 03, 2011 2:18 am

discspeed wrote:
JR wrote:
jubuttib wrote:@zj: That's why I still have the C-MD2 in my bag. The Axis is absolutely fantastic on finesse shots (and discspeed said that it's a new type of mid: It's a slightly improved version of the orange FR P-MD2's :) ) but I really like having a disc I can rip without worrying about it.


Axis and Ion are more sensitive to the release angle than most discs if you measure how far off sideways you land per a degree of miss in the hyzer angle.


I have to really think about this one...I think you may be right as the discs will hold exact lines a little more than most discs, but they also still push forward on whatever angle they fly on for me. I suspect this can also be manipulated by adjust the amount of forward momentum vs. spin on your throw because I think I do some of this only semi-consciously when I throw different lines. l know that I feel a pinpoint touch on the Ion and Axis that I don't or haven't with other similar discs, but I'm not always on with them. When I'm not exactly on though they are still fairly forgiving for me, I'm just not getting exactly what I visualize like I can at other times.


Gyro discs hold lines extremely well and are at the top for glide among all of the discs available and fading forward maintaining altitude even when not flat all together minimize power needs and maximize sideways motion. That also means that they punish hard for hyzer angle misses and reward finesse shots with proper point and shoot at the target in a flat shot. Or mildly turning intended throws. Sharp turns in winds are risky. Headwinds especially, because on Saturday Ion and Axis flipped bad in headwinds. I practiced a mando hole that has a sharp turn right and the throws went rollers despite being about 30' high. It's a fairly short hole with lots of sideways motion required.

Straight flat shots and hyzer flipped to flat harder shots are easier to visualize than with other discs, because of the straight line flight. The same reason why i like laser putts as far as the laws of nature allows without excessive blow by distance and power requirement.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: Axis of Evil

Postby discspeed » Mon Oct 03, 2011 6:36 am

Rogue9 wrote:What do mean by more finesse?


Throwing slower and smoother rather than a more driver-like delivery.
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Re: Axis of Evil

Postby bill » Mon Oct 03, 2011 6:48 am

discspeed wrote:I don't know why, but when I was first warming up today I couldn't get the Axis going. I threw a 280' low ceiling hole 2 times with 2 different Axis and I didn't have a single good shot...I finally realized that I was trying to power them too much like a Buzzz. After that I gave them a bit more finesse and a slightly higher/nose neutral trajectory and parked both discs. From that point on I was good with them.


in the field i was giving my mids a lot of power and the axis was flipping on me. when i slowed down it flew straight with a slight s curve and was really easy to place and keep low. it doesn't seem as sensitive as a fuse or even a comet but it definitely wants less than full power.
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Re: Axis of Evil

Postby Mike C » Mon Oct 03, 2011 9:16 am

Is that with a flat release or hyzer? If I give it some hyzer I can throw mine as hard as I want without them flipping over.
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Re: Axis of Evil

Postby bill » Mon Oct 03, 2011 9:22 am

yeah pretty flat release with a lot of snap. i'll try a more deliberate hyzer release tonight.
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Re: Axis of Evil

Postby Frank Delicious » Mon Oct 03, 2011 10:03 am

So I threw a couple green axis this weekend while I was down in charlotte. It was super windy this whole weekend and the only good throws with the axis was with tailwinds or right to left winds. It was not a fan of the wind at all. It was never calm enough for me to get a true feel for the disc which was too bad because I was excited to see how these things flew. The complete lack of wind handling was a little weird though, it seems like it would be able to handle some wind.
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Re: Axis of Evil

Postby bill » Mon Oct 03, 2011 10:10 am

Frank Delicious wrote:It was not a fan of the wind at all.


that's way true.
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Re: Axis of Evil

Postby Segovia » Mon Oct 03, 2011 10:10 am

I'm probably a little bit of an exception *, but I still am seeing NO flip on 330'+ shots with my either of mine. They go *exactly* how I throw them for 90% of the flight. I'm still getting used to this fact, since I've pretty exclusively thrown roc's in this spot. I need to remind myself that these really don't fade much at the end of their flights unless I throw them with hyzer. I wouldn't say I have a TON of power, but I can get Teebirds to 400' consistently. I'm still not sure if these will find a spot in my bag or not. I'm pretty comfortable with just a Roc/Fuse setup but I'm giving these a try for a while.

*my "problem" this year has been that I throw too cleanly. I was having trouble flipping anything over at all for alot of the summer. Even throwing a Fuse 300+ from a slight hyzer I couldn't get them to turn much at all; beat to hell TL's weren't turning much on 375'+ shots. I've been working on adding some OAT back in slowly, but I still tend to throw SUPER clean when I'm throwing hard.
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Re: Axis of Evil

Postby cmrichar » Mon Oct 03, 2011 11:27 am

bill wrote:
Frank Delicious wrote:It was not a fan of the wind at all.
that's way true.
With this disc design, we were shooting for a straight/neutral flight, so some winds can get the best of it. I wouldn't classify the Axis having entirely stable/fade characteristics.
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Re: Axis of Evil

Postby bill » Mon Oct 03, 2011 11:52 am

cmrichar wrote:
bill wrote:
Frank Delicious wrote:It was not a fan of the wind at all.
that's way true.
With this disc design, we were shooting for a straight/neutral flight, so some winds can get the best of it. I wouldn't classify the Axis having entirely stable/fade characteristics.


no. and i really don't think it's an issue except that i'll miss it when it's windy.
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