FTT's (slower) bag project

[JR]

I'd start out with a light Pro Wraith. That will break in faster although the fade is still there mostly. It probably won't ever be a straight disc.

[Fightingthetide]

Can someone describe exactly what people mean when they say Eagle X's are "more workable" than Teebirds? Is it their ability to fly on turnover lines and still finish with solid fade? I've seen a few guys put EX's on really beautiful lines recently - nice turnover shots that still faded out well at the end. I'm guessing this is the "more workable" aspect.

I picked up a friend's EX the other day and it felt completely different from the EX that I used to have. His EX had less dome and fit SO much better into my hand. I made a comment about it, and he said that you really have to hand-pick EX's. Anyone else have this experience?

If I'm not mistaken, EX's have a shallower rim, which also makes me wonder if I would like them better. TB's have deeper rims, and I've been having some issues with using them on forehand shots. I have much more accuracy with my Banshee (shallower rim), except the strong fade gets me in trouble sometimes, which is another reason why I wonder if EX's would work better for me.

Has anyone else switched from TB's to EX's based on this? I think if I did make the switch I would keep my Champ and Pro Leo's, and pick up a flat Champ, a flat-ish Star, and 2 or 3 DX's.

I'd start out with a light Pro Wraith. That will break in faster although the fade is still there mostly. It probably won't ever be a straight disc.

I ended up getting a 170 Star Wraith with a nice gradual dome. I wanted one that would handle some wind or could be flexed out a little. I have yet to throw it next to my Archon (and I have yet to throw my Archon more than 3 times), but once I get some field and course time with them, I'll report back. I feel really comfortable holding them, and I know that doesn't say much, but I'm an optimist and would like to think that these will get some extra D for me without sacrificing much accuracy. One thing is for certain, they won't be my main driver...i'll pull them out on open fairways (which isn't all too often depending on the course).

[JR]

At first you should probably carry both the Wraith and the Archon for open long distance, because one goes left and the other right. For all the reasons you mentioned the EX should suit you. I just wonder how beat and light the one you tried was. I had a flat new 175, that was too much for me. If i wanted an anny i had to release it anny, because it had no turn and had a hard fade. Way different to my 166, broken in one.

[Fightingthetide]

At first you should probably carry both the Wraith and the Archon for open long distance, because one goes left and the other right. For all the reasons you mentioned the EX should suit you. I just wonder how beat and light the one you tried was. I had a flat new 175, that was too much for me. If i wanted an anny i had to release it anny, because it had no turn and had a hard fade. Way different to my 166, broken in one.

Yeah I'll stick to both the Archon and Wraith...that was the original plan. I might not have been clear about that. I was saying that I'll try them next to each other so I can see how each handles my headwind and tailwind distance slots respectively.

I'll go the route of picking up a 166ish Star EX at first. Mine was a domey 173 Star. The dome made it fit weird into my hand and probably slowed it down and the weight/newness made it too overstable...which are the three reasons I gave it up.

[Monocacy]

Can someone describe exactly what people mean when they say Eagle X's are "more workable" than Teebirds? Is it their ability to fly on turnover lines and still finish with solid fade? I've seen a few guys put EX's on really beautiful lines recently - nice turnover shots that still faded out well at the end. I'm guessing this is the "more workable" aspect.

Yep, that's it. I think of "workable" as the opposite of "holds the line". To use midrange examples: Comets hold a line; fresh Rocs are workable.

[Fightingthetide]

Got some field time today. Both had their flash removed on my carpet...smoooth!

170 Star Wraith:
Still fresh and overstable. It did well on lower lines and was able to flex out of subtle anhyzers really well, even into a slight headwind. I know exactly where and how this will fit into my bag and expect it to season really well and give me more of the results I want - workable with strong fade, and still able to take some headwind.

166 Star Archon:
It is indeed understable out of the box, but very controllable. It is probably THE most controllable understable disc I have yet to throw (compared to beat pro leo's and Roadrunners, etc). It worked really well into tailwinds (flat or subtle hyzer) and even soft headwinds (more hyzer). It also locked into a beautiful turning line downhill, and I expect it to work just as well uphill.


Overall, I am really excited about this setup for a few reasons - headwind and tailwind distance, good distance on lower lines, and even more distance when I have more space. I'm getting more D than my speed-7 discs, but not losing very much in terms of accuracy.

[Fightingthetide]

Question: What qualifies as a champystar blend and how do you know if you have it? My Wraith is somewhat transparent in that it's really easy to see where the rim meets the flight plate on the bottom of the disc, while looking down at the top of the disc, as if the rim were a shadow. Make sense? Am I looking at a champystar blend?

What are the differences in flight characteristics/durability with champystar vs. pure star?

[JR]

At first you should probably carry both the Wraith and the Archon for open long distance, because one goes left and the other right. For all the reasons you mentioned the EX should suit you. I just wonder how beat and light the one you tried was. I had a flat new 175, that was too much for me. If i wanted an anny i had to release it anny, because it had no turn and had a hard fade. Way different to my 166, broken in one.

Yeah I'll stick to both the Archon and Wraith...that was the original plan. I might not have been clear about that. I was saying that I'll try them next to each other so I can see how each handles my headwind and tailwind distance slots respectively.

I'll go the route of picking up a 166ish Star EX at first. Mine was a domey 173 Star. The dome made it fit weird into my hand and probably slowed it down and the weight/newness made it too overstable...which are the three reasons I gave it up.

The thin Star 175 EX i donated was a hog. More power requirement than i could give it and really hard fade, close to dump fade pig discs.

[Fightingthetide]

I'm still thinking about picking up a lighter Eagle, as well as a new Star TL instead of another Teebird for placement shots. Will this work? Or would it be mold-overkill?

[JR]

That should work well, because lighter Eagles are much more versatile.

[Fightingthetide]

That should work well, because lighter Eagles are much more versatile.

This is where I am torn. Essentially, I have 8 spots in my bag for drivers. 12 total spots (Fade Crunch Box) with 4 taken up by mids. I don't really want to buy a bigger bag, because I know that I would just fill it up with even more discs and probably wouldn't learn them.

So my issue is how to fill those 8 spots well. I have 6 spots taken up that i am comfortable with, and 2 remaining spots that I keep going back and forth on. It's coming down to the old Eagle vs. Teebird argument for me. How would you (or anyone) fill these two slots?

1- Headwind D - Wraith
2- Tailwind D - Archon
3- Very Overstable - Banshee
4- Overstable - ??? (Eagle-X or Teebird), for some headwind duties but primarily forehand
5- Stable Control - ??? (Teebird or TL), for control with a touch more fade
6- Stable Control - TL, seasoned for slight hyzerflip control
7- Understable - Champ Leo, for workable understable lines
8- Understable - Pro Leo, for true understable lines

[Crosseyed0811]

The Eagle-X is typically considered a better FH driver than the Teebird.

[JR]

Leo is a good hyzer flipper and not really that much shorter than the TL so there is a clear overlap possibility there. And resolving that may influence 4,5 and 6. Because the TL or Leo both can handle straight duties and the Eagle X is better FH than a TB i have no trouble recommending in favor of the SEX for 6. 5 depends on 4 and may not even be needed, unless winds are an issue. If you build in wind tolerance in straighter lines than the EX can give you, a Champion Teebird would fit the bill in over 166 weight.

[Fightingthetide]

Leo is a good hyzer flipper and not really that much shorter than the TL so there is a clear overlap possibility there. And resolving that may influence 4,5 and 6. Because the TL or Leo both can handle straight duties and the Eagle X is better FH than a TB i have no trouble recommending in favor of the SEX for 6. 5 depends on 4 and may not even be needed, unless winds are an issue. If you build in wind tolerance in straighter lines than the EX can give you, a Champion Teebird would fit the bill in over 166 weight.

So you are saying:

3 - Very Overstable - 173 Champ Banshee
4 - Overstable - 170 Champ Teebird
5 - Stable Control - 165-168 Star Eagle-X
6 - Understable - 175 Champ Leo, workable understable lines, hyzerflip straight
7 - Understable - 171 Pro Leo, slow turning lines
8 - Understable - 175 Pro Leo, beat-in for niche shots and super strong tailwinds
(I removed the second "stable control" spot and added my beat-in pro leo)

The only disc I dont currently own here would be a lighter Star EX. My only question now is whether it would work better to have a 168ish Star EX in the overstable slot (forehand, some wind duties) and a 168ish Star TB in the stable control slot? That's only an issue of semantics...I'll probably pick up both and see how they fly.

EDIT: What about a 170-172 Star EX and a 165-167 Star EX to fill 4 and 5?

[JR]

A 175 SEX would be more wind fighting and more overstable than a Champ TB. At least if it is a flat SEX. Otherwise it looks ok, but there are alwas personal preference issues, which is why you should get both a TB and at least a mid 160s SEX.