Woods Advice For A Sporadic Roc Tosser

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Re: Woods Advice For A Sporadic Roc Tosser

Postby Frank Delicious » Tue May 22, 2012 5:55 pm

The axis I got when they first came out would both turn and fade (if thrown high enough).
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Re: Woods Advice For A Sporadic Roc Tosser

Postby jubuttib » Tue May 22, 2012 6:56 pm

Frank Delicious wrote:The axis I got when they first came out would both turn and fade (if thrown high enough).
Every disc fades when thrown high enough. That turn is news to me though.
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Re: Woods Advice For A Sporadic Roc Tosser

Postby InvaderMirO » Wed May 23, 2012 9:26 am

no fade or turn really out of my axis.

so what then happens when one seasons a roc?
most discs tend to lose HSS as they get beat yet maintain some fade, i would assume rocs work the same and simply become turnover discs as they get worn in and eventually beating into either shreads of plastic or a roller disc.
does the roc possess some sort of magical ability that when seasoned it turns into something completely different?
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Re: Woods Advice For A Sporadic Roc Tosser

Postby Frank Delicious » Wed May 23, 2012 9:44 am

Now I want to retry an axis.
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Re: Woods Advice For A Sporadic Roc Tosser

Postby victorb » Wed May 23, 2012 10:52 am

InvaderMirO wrote:no fade or turn really out of my axis.

so what then happens when one seasons a roc?
most discs tend to lose HSS as they get beat yet maintain some fade, i would assume rocs work the same and simply become turnover discs as they get worn in and eventually beating into either shreads of plastic or a roller disc.
does the roc possess some sort of magical ability that when seasoned it turns into something completely different?


Most high end plastics and newer disc molds will tend to lose their HSS first. Older discs in DX plastic like the Roc, Teebird, Eagle, Gazelle, etc will lose their LSS first, making them very straight and controllable for a good portion of it's life. A Roc has to really be beating in for a while to get it into the 'turnover midrange' slot (the ontario mold will get there faster than the rancho or san marino)

So, to answer your question: Yes, the Roc (as well as a few other discs) do have a magical ability to become different as they season.* That's why 'cycling' rocs is such a popular strategy - in different stages of wear, they become different types of useful discs all from the same mold. This is also a big benefit of throwing baseline plastic discs. Your Roc is too straight for hyzer shots now? Go buy a new one, and keep the straight one. Your roc turns too much, even when thrown from a hyzer? Congratulations, you now have 3 rocs in your bag, overstable, stable, and understable. The best part(s)? They cost $9, are easy to replace, and don't take years to beat in like premium plastic does.



*Protip: Basically any mold that was created with the intent to be manufactured in baseline plastic will do this.
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Re: Woods Advice For A Sporadic Roc Tosser

Postby InvaderMirO » Wed May 23, 2012 1:56 pm

i will have to bring some out and try them again. Do the KC Pro Rocs beat in well also? they are much harder but the plastic does still get gouged up.

id say currently the axis and vector are my most thrown and most comfortable discs, i know how they fly and for most of the holes around here <350 they are all i need.
though i still am looking for a shorter and more controlled midrange for upshots where my putters don't have a good line.

i tried to cycle worn teebirds for a while but didn't have that great of luck. i found that after a good tree hit they would always fly much different, going from a nice stable straight flyer on one throw and then flippy like a roadrunner on the next.
this could have largely been due to user error as i wasn't a consistent player at that time and i was looking to teebirds as a "simplify my bag, and only throw rocs/teebirds phase"
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Re: Woods Advice For A Sporadic Roc Tosser

Postby victorb » Thu May 24, 2012 6:05 am

KC Pro Rocs typically beat in a lot slower than their DX counterparts. Main exception is the crappy run of 12x plastic that was really soft, more like a stiffer dx, not what you want from a KC Pro.

Cycling Teebirds is a much different story than cycling Rocs. Teebirds are really only good at one direction flights. Cycling eagles is where it's at for those fairway drivers. I love dx teebirds, but still sit them next to a star and champ in my bag, and pair the mold with predators and jackals simply because they aren't super versatile.

DX Rocs work with cycling just because they are closer to eagles in terms of versatility and ability to shape shots (especially if you add in KC Pro or premium plastic into the equation)
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Re: Woods Advice For A Sporadic Roc Tosser

Postby dgdave » Sat May 26, 2012 12:32 pm

All my 3 axis (1 1st run and 2 non 1st run) are just straight. Really no turn to speak of.
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Re: Woods Advice For A Sporadic Roc Tosser

Postby JR » Sun May 27, 2012 1:36 am

Mine are straight only when i get a clean release and a lot of spin on the disc. Meaning no margin of error OAT wise. That is a bad thing for tunnels where a straight flight is needed.

Another straight disc that can move a ton sideways both left and right if you miss hyzer angle is a Mako. A Coyote glides a hair less and fades a hair more at under 310' or so and over that starts to straighten out to almost match the Mako in straightness of the finish. The Coyote won't turn for me at 280-300' but at full tilt i may have a wrist roll or the disc flips about two to three degrees and given height will flex back to flat or on a very high throw fades a smidge not that many feet. Unless it runs out of speed at altitude.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: Woods Advice For A Sporadic Roc Tosser

Postby AcesAZ » Wed May 30, 2012 10:35 am

My KC Pro Roc 176 White that I bought recently is super durable, Stiff and quite hard plastic. Not even comparable to DX Roc in wear. Much more durable then Pro plastic in other molds as well. Ive hardly gotten a scrape out of it, while DX on one bad tree or rock hit can take a big gouge out. So if you want a more durable Roc, KC Pro is the best choice.
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Re: Woods Advice For A Sporadic Roc Tosser

Postby Drowsy » Sun Jun 17, 2012 1:29 pm

victorb wrote:
InvaderMirO wrote:
Yes, the Roc (as well as a few other discs) do have a magical ability to become different as they season.* That's why 'cycling' rocs is such a popular strategy - in different stages of wear, they become different types of useful discs all from the same mold. This is also a big benefit of throwing baseline plastic discs. Your Roc is too straight for hyzer shots now? Go buy a new one, and keep the straight one. Your roc turns too much, even when thrown from a hyzer? Congratulations, you now have 3 rocs in your bag, overstable, stable, and understable. The best part(s)? They cost $9, are easy to replace, and don't take years to beat in like premium plastic does.


*Protip: Basically any mold that was created with the intent to be manufactured in baseline plastic will do this.


I prefer to have a disc that when I buy it, it suits the role I bought it for. And not just for 3-6 months. If you want a stable midrange, buy a z buzzz and smile. It's the best midrange at flying straight and you didn't need to throw it for 4 months to get it to fly like that. It will also cover your understable slot. Then buy a star rancho roc and smile again. You have an overstable midrange. Now you have 2 discs that will cover all three of those shots and they are made of a plastic that will hold it's stability a long time. I figure you will end up spending more money replacing discs that have worn out they're usefulness before I will lose a premium plastic disc. I hear about people throwing dx frequently on the forum, but everywhere I go, and all the usdgc videos I have watched, and all the leagues I play, DX does one thing well. IT FLIES OVER WATER. ;]
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Re: Woods Advice For A Sporadic Roc Tosser

Postby Frank Delicious » Sun Jun 17, 2012 3:42 pm

You must not go a lot of places because a lot of the pros and adv players around here throw DX rocs.
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Re: Woods Advice For A Sporadic Roc Tosser

Postby Working Stiff » Sun Jun 17, 2012 4:04 pm

Drowsy wrote:I prefer to have a disc that when I buy it, it suits the role I bought it for.
A lot of people are like this. That's why Champ and Star discs sell so well. You just don't get to experience the awesomeness of a sweetly beat in DX disc. :wink:
Furthur wrote:Either get a lighter one, throw harder, or find a disc with more glide.
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Re: Woods Advice For A Sporadic Roc Tosser

Postby Drowsy » Sun Jun 17, 2012 5:30 pm

I did the dx cycling thing about 5 years ago. Its great when you have a stable roc. Sucks when you lose one. I did, and my friend handed me a buzzz. I wasnt big on discrapft at the time. Threw it. Loved it. Never looked back.
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Re: Woods Advice For A Sporadic Roc Tosser

Postby victorb » Mon Jun 18, 2012 10:24 am

Drowsy wrote:
victorb wrote:
InvaderMirO wrote:
Yes, the Roc (as well as a few other discs) do have a magical ability to become different as they season.* That's why 'cycling' rocs is such a popular strategy - in different stages of wear, they become different types of useful discs all from the same mold. This is also a big benefit of throwing baseline plastic discs. Your Roc is too straight for hyzer shots now? Go buy a new one, and keep the straight one. Your roc turns too much, even when thrown from a hyzer? Congratulations, you now have 3 rocs in your bag, overstable, stable, and understable. The best part(s)? They cost $9, are easy to replace, and don't take years to beat in like premium plastic does.


*Protip: Basically any mold that was created with the intent to be manufactured in baseline plastic will do this.


I prefer to have a disc that when I buy it, it suits the role I bought it for. And not just for 3-6 months. If you want a stable midrange, buy a z buzzz and smile. It's the best midrange at flying straight and you didn't need to throw it for 4 months to get it to fly like that. It will also cover your understable slot. Then buy a star rancho roc and smile again. You have an overstable midrange. Now you have 2 discs that will cover all three of those shots and they are made of a plastic that will hold it's stability a long time. I figure you will end up spending more money replacing discs that have worn out they're usefulness before I will lose a premium plastic disc. I hear about people throwing dx frequently on the forum, but everywhere I go, and all the usdgc videos I have watched, and all the leagues I play, DX does one thing well. IT FLIES OVER WATER. ;]


The whole point of using rocs is to have the same feel and the same mold to be able to cover your spectrum of midrange shots. Most people that throw a buzzz do so because they don't like the beaded mold of a roc or comet or whatever. Have fun losing your 4 year old flippy buzzz that you can't buy a replacement for off the shelf, in the same mold. I'll just pull another roc out of my stash and put it in the rotation without flinching.

it takes a LOT longer than 3-6 months to break the stability out of a dx rancho roc. other than that, I really don't have much to say since there are people that just prefer premium plastic midranges no matter the reasoning.
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