Advanced Consistency + Putting and Rollers

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Advanced Consistency + Putting and Rollers

Postby plex » Thu Jun 21, 2012 2:20 pm

I'm an advanced player, been playing in tournaments and leagues for a while now, always placing 2rd or better lately but... i cant get to a point of consistency that i want to be at to play in and win higher level events besides local tourneys and leagues.

I cant seem to find any videos or articles about consistency, how to become more consistent for advanced players.

I have just been playing A LOT of rounds lately thinking that will just naturally make me more consistent over time and it seems like either my putting is on and my drives are average, but usually my driving is amazing and my putting is trash. I have my own high quality basket in my backyard and practice putting 4 times a week on it usually for around 15-30 minutes outside of playing rounds every day after work.

What can i do to become so consistent that i can place the disc EXACTLY where i want every time, whether it be putting or driving?

Driving:
Power grip with middle fingers ticked and index and pinky finger not tucked but up against the inside rim (Feldberg/Climo power grip)
^^This works great for me all the time for any shot

Midrange:
Same Power Grip as drivers for longer shots
Power/Fan Grip combo for more controlled throws

Putting:
Fan grip with pinky resting on top of ring finger.. its weird but comfortable for me and seems to prevent my pinky from getting in the way and causing OAT on release

Aside from increasing consistency, I also want to learn how to throw rollers.. so if anyone can share a video or artice with an in depth explanation on the mechanics and form of a roller that would be great.. also what discs work best?

My current bag has S/DS Destroyers, Swords, 11x Eagles, CE Eagles, GL-Rivers, and lots of Axis, Vectors, Ions
Last edited by plex on Sat Jun 23, 2012 3:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Advanced Consistency + Rollers

Postby itlnstln » Fri Jun 22, 2012 7:15 am

I can't say that I have had the same success in tournaments, but...

I use the Climo fork grip for all shots including drives (except putts). I get a cleaner release and while I might not get as much power, it's very easy to control. Also, telegraphing your shot helps, too (see the DGR article on the main page if you haven't read it yet). Learning to slow down and focus on strong technique instead of strong shots helped me, too. There are also a ton of great articles on the main page about building consistency that have helped me over the last several years.

The one thing I can't seem to conquer is the head-game. I'll throw -5 in a casual round and +5 in a tourney every time (I psych myself out in the putting game).
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Re: Advanced Consistency + Rollers

Postby itlnstln » Fri Jun 22, 2012 7:20 am

For BH rollers, I use a beat champ Valk. The form is the same as any other shot but with a lot of (backward, obviously) arch in the back. The learning (trial and error) is to find out how different angles of impact and how long you throw in the air before it lands affects your shot. For long rollers, I try to leave the disc in the air for a fairly long time and try to land the disc similar to this angle or maybe steeper: \ For short rollers, or ones I need a strong right turn (I'm a right-handed thrower), I might use a more vertical angle: |

If I need a left turn or I have a trouble shot, I might throw a FH roller.
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Re: Advanced Consistency + Rollers

Postby zj1002 » Fri Jun 22, 2012 11:21 am

Rollers are in my opinion one of the easier shots to learn but hardest to master

The way the nose angle lands plays a huge part
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Re: Advanced Consistency + Rollers

Postby JR » Fri Jun 22, 2012 11:53 am

Slowing down is key. Using thinner putters so that no finger sticks helps a ton. Check out this video and also the others from the same channel

Lots of putting with more than one identical putting gets in more shots faster. Keeping the arm muscles loose for an explosive acceleration prior to the elbow becoming straight is key. Boxing helps in increasing arm straightening speed so it takes less arm effort=looser muscles=more consistent accuracy to get equally far. Or you'll putt farther with the same consistency and accuracy. Field practice for drives and approaches.

Golf is not a game of perfect. Everyone misses even the best players so not missing is a futile goal and only aggravates you and messes up your head game. Don't fall for that trap it'll cost strokes per round.

One trick for shorter control discs for increased consistency and accuracy is not to reach back as far as you can but limit to where you only lose eye contact to the target momentarily or not at all. And pulling the disc in a straight line not in an arc. That requires bending the elbow and leading with it plus timing all lower body movements correctly.

Try to get discs that are tacky enough to not slip out and adjusting grip finger amount, placement, squeezing pressure, onset of squeezing time and the rate at which you increase the squeezing pressure. In order to eliminate slips tacky disc with a lot of very early grip strength should be used as a starting point in a field practice session. Then you should start to use less and less squeeze power later and later and only pinching at maximum strength as late as possible. So that you see when you need to pinch, how hard amd how late and quick the pinch power addition needs to be.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: Advanced Consistency + Putting, Rollers

Postby plex » Sat Jun 23, 2012 3:40 pm

JR. Thats exactly what i needed, thanks, the tip on grip strength helped me learn something new at the tee pad today :)

If anyone has any advanced in depth videos on putting form and release i would really appreciate it

my putting is going downhill so fast lately and i don't know why.. maybe i just need to rethink what im doing when i step up to a putt (or stop thinking too much haha)

i cant seem to find that control in my putts i used to have, its as if i cant concentrate or focus on what i need to do in order to place that disc in the center of the chains.. the disc seems to come out clean, but almost always fades too soon or falls short. and sometimes i miss all together when i should be making these easy 15-20 feet putts.

i used to sink putts easy from outside the circle with my IONs and now im getting worse..

one theory is that my driving is getting so good that when i park it more often im not getting that putting practice i used to get all the time.. who knows?

any good videos on a consistency building technique for putting would be wonderful!

Thanks guys :)
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Re: Advanced Consistency + Putting and Rollers

Postby JR » Sun Jun 24, 2012 1:43 am

Disc Golf Monthly had clinics in i think episodes 95 & 96.

You can lose a putt before you take a disc in the hand. 90 % concentration is almost always a miss from anything but the shortest of distances. Listen to Dave Dunipace on Deep In The Game video on putting on Youtube and look at the Innova website
for Dave's putting tips. I fully agree with the fast elbow extension bit. But equally as important is to not allow the elbow to straighten out before the disc has left. One leads to the other if failed but Dave didn't stress that. I'd make sure that you are balanced with a good stance and perfectly squared at the target. It needs to be checked visually. Look at Doss putting and you see how he visually checks that the center line of the disc is on the pole once his arm is extended fully. The arm needs to be on the center line always on shorter putts. The arm needs to move the disc in a straight line always. When you get farther out you need to adjust your stance to point right of the target to allow the disc to fade to the pole.

Since you were good at long distances power generation is a major issue and the elbow straightening punch forward is king. After that comes a large weight shift. So look at Jay and Des Reading for balanced motion with the arm and the opposite leg extending in sync for balance. They also bend their hips back in the reach back and push the pelvis at the target in the throw before the arm starts to accelerate hard. Starting with the front heel down ending up on the ball of the foot maximizes the weight shift. That reduces the need to punch the arm forward at 100 % power which increases consistency a lot. Accuracy too for some amount. It depends on your muscle power and flexibility how much of an impact the reduced power makes to your accuracy.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: Advanced Consistency + Putting and Rollers

Postby Mark Ellis » Mon Jun 25, 2012 4:19 pm

plex wrote:I'm an advanced player, been playing in tournaments and leagues for a while now, always placing 2rd or better lately but... i cant get to a point of consistency that i want to be at to play in and win higher level events besides local tourneys and leagues.


I have just been playing A LOT of rounds lately thinking that will just naturally make me more consistent over time and it seems like either my putting is on and my drives are average, but usually my driving is amazing and my putting is trash. I have my own high quality basket in my backyard and practice putting 4 times a week on it usually for around 15-30 minutes outside of playing rounds every day after work.

What can i do to become so consistent that i can place the disc EXACTLY where i want every time, whether it be putting or driving?


Everyone reaches plateaus. Making the next jump becomes increasingly harder the better you become. Imagine being a 1010 rated player and trying to get to the 1030's. Worse, imagine being 1030 and desiring 1060, a level no one has attained (as an average, not an individual round).

The answer to whether plex (or any of us) can make the next jump probably comes down to will power and natural talent. As plex is still an amateur and his biggest weakness is putting, if he continues to practice putting he will surely improve. I can say this with certainty because as the former worlds worst putter (or so close to it the distinction is irrelevant) I know the long term benefit of practice putting. More on that below.

No one knows where their upper limits lie until they are in an inescapable decline due to age, injury or loss of hope. But never underestimate the long term benefits of diligent practice. Motivation is the most important factor in success, easily eclipsing talent.

If plex commits to practice putting he will improve. Here is a short cut. When you practice, do it without expectation of immediate payoff. Don't practice today to putt better this weekend. That just messes with your head. Just putt to get better eventually and commit to the practice. Work on both mechanics as well pressure. So invent games and compete with yourself and others. Make putts from every angle and obstacle and wind and footing and distance. Make putts count with prizes or penalties. Make your practice more challenging than anything you face in a tournament round. In the long run this will pay off. You already know this in your heart.

The process of getting better is not just about changing from poor to good or from good to great. It is about changing by coming closer to the line, closer to the height, the speed and the angle. Getting better is about missing by less when you miss. When you miss by less some days your misses no longer miss, they barely go in. When these days happen they boost your confidence and you jump a level. Now your bad days are no longer as bad and your good days are better than they ever were-your whole level raises.

Will you ever become error free? No. Nor do you need to because nobody else is error free either. You have no right to beat someone who works harder than you, has greater talent and handles pressure better. But some days you will because luck factors in. Besides no one wears a label describing what their true skill is. Or their potential.
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Re: Advanced Consistency + Putting and Rollers

Postby cubeofsoup » Wed Jul 11, 2012 11:11 am

Mark Ellis wrote:The process of getting better is not just about changing from poor to good or from good to great. It is about changing by coming closer to the line, closer to the height, the speed and the angle. Getting better is about missing by less when you miss. When you miss by less some days your misses no longer miss, they barely go in. When these days happen they boost your confidence and you jump a level. Now your bad days are no longer as bad and your good days are better than they ever were-your whole level raises.


Such an outstanding way to phrase that. Well put Mark. Two years ago in ball golf my good days were 45's now those are my bad days and my good days are 38's. I think one way to help yourself improve is by setting goals and expectations that are a good balance of challenging but achievable. Small things in the short term will help to build confidence, longer terms goals will show overall improvement.

Personally I need to ditch my goals about distance and just focus on my consistency and putting. Killing myself over not being able to hit 350' all the time isn't going to make it happen any faster.
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