Plastic preference?

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Re: Plastic preference?

Postby jubuttib » Mon Jul 09, 2012 2:55 pm

Star usually breaks in and overall wears much faster than Champ, and there's no way a DX or Pro disc would be broken in in like 25 throws, unless you hit the trees every time.
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Re: Plastic preference?

Postby JR » Mon Jul 09, 2012 8:45 pm

jubuttib wrote:Star usually breaks in and overall wears much faster than Champ, and there's no way a DX or Pro disc would be broken in in like 25 throws, unless you hit the trees every time.


There are exceptions like the DX Valkyrie that changes drastically with the first hard hit. My yellow Star Wedge changed a lot just being in the bag with lots of other discs.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: Plastic preference?

Postby JR » Mon Jul 09, 2012 8:54 pm

ladysmanfelpz wrote:So i am noticing more how certain discs are better in certain plastics. My question for everyone here is how long does each plastic type seem to last for everyone before it breaks? I don't mean break in, but like breaks where it is too unpredictable to be useful anymore. I had a dx boss which was fun for a bit, but then I hit a tree hard and I could just tell the way it came off it wasn't going to be right. I play wooded courses and ive hit trees with plenty of dx and I can tell they will be alright, but sometimes with a weird hit I can tell it "broke" by the way it came off. So now this boss can get some alright flights, but will have a weird and unpredictable turn. It will turn very hard when it definitely wasn't supposed to. Same thing with my pro starfire. Great disc and had plenty of flight left in it, but it took a hard smack into a tree. The way it came off I could tell it broke. Sure enough next through it came off right and started to do its soft turn and then got more fluttery mid flight than at release which is very odd and became very understable and never came back. So I needed a mid and wanted to try a good run plastic so got a z buzzz. First day out with it it was sick. Did everything I wanted it too. Could forehand it 300'+ and rip backhands. Nearly got 2 aces with it my first day. I know a disc breaks in, but after that first day, I can no longer forehand it. I am throwing it very different know and it seems less predictable to me. Still a sweet disc, but I am surprised by how much the z changed after one day of play. So far doesn't seem so much tougher than the dx I usually buy even playing in the woods. My dx destroyer has lasted I would say about 80 throws and taken a few good smacks, but nothing where it look like it broke. So what do you think the life of each type of plastic is? Have you noticed a champ or star run plastic "break"?
I'm saying:
Dx/D: 10-20 throws to break in. Life ~100
Pro/elite: 25 throws to break in. Life ~180
Z/Champ: 30 to break in. Life ~250-infinite
Star: 60 to break in. Life ~200-infinite


As a rule those numbers are way off and even primo plastics wear so nope to infinity but granted you are more likely to lose them first. Some DX discs can last hundreds of tosses even on rockly courses as long as you don't throw super hard and some discs in Pro fly well after wear and can last more in the thousands of throws than 180. Throwing form is a big issue in not flipping the disc. Your DX Boss may have illustrated the concept of speed stability for you. It means that a new disc is overstable for a 400' shot in calm conditions and in a headwind a 370' thrower flips it hard. And nose angle plus winds means that the disc can either go left or flip hard unpredictably from one throw to another at your power and more often be a roller for a higher powered player. Entering wear of the disc into the equation means that the disc flips more, more often and especially unpredictably.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: Plastic preference?

Postby ladysmanfelpz » Wed Jul 11, 2012 10:35 am

Ya i guess my perspective on dx. I got taht misconception from owning a dx valk, and now that im hearing the dx valk is an exception from a lot of people I trust dx a little more. It was literally my 3rd throw with the dx valk and it took a hard one into a tree right off the tee and never flew right after that. And I can rip the dx boss and it has a beautiful slow fade, it is just way too hard to control for me
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Re: Plastic preference?

Postby JR » Thu Jul 12, 2012 4:33 pm

DX Rocs, Spiders and Gators hold up well for being base plastics and putting only DX putters are gonna last a long time.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: Plastic preference?

Postby vtbuzzz » Thu Jul 12, 2012 5:28 pm

Blue pro plastic is pretty nice, my main driver is a blue pro valk in various states of wear
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Re: Plastic preference?

Postby ladysmanfelpz » Tue Jul 17, 2012 1:43 pm

Ya i like the pro the best, but I still finds it wears out pretty bad after a while. My pro firebird and take a rip, but other times will be all fluttery and do some weird stuff. Just got some star drivers and a set of good midranges and its really changing my game. Finding I like the star for drivers, dx z or whatever for midrange, and whatever for putters.
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Re: Plastic preference?

Postby ladysmanfelpz » Wed Jul 18, 2012 11:43 pm

Also has anybody tried getting an overstable disc in baseline plastic and letting it wear in? Done that with a few and really like it. Had a dx firebird and dx teerex that still always faded back, but brought out just the right of turn really late in the flight tho. Bought a pro d force today and it was sick! Throughout the round I could tell it wearing a little bit too. Problem is I lost it :( How does the pro D plastic of discraft compare to dx?
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Re: Plastic preference?

Postby JTdisc » Thu Jul 19, 2012 6:35 am

ladysmanfelpz wrote: How does the pro D plastic of discraft compare to dx?


In my experience, pro D of Discraft is extremely fragile for anything but a putter. I had a new Stratus hit a tree and fold, leaving a large crease in the disc. I also have a new pro D Buzzz that is getting a little oddly shaped after a tree collision or two.

Innova DX gets scratched, dinged, or gets little chunks knocked out of it while retaining it's overall shape. For thinner drivers or mids Discraft pro D seems to get warped or malformed rather than just dinged.

For putters the two have been the same for me. My pro D Challenger has held up as well as my DX Aviar so far.

I'm a big fan of Discraft, and love my Z plastic discs, but I will not buy anything in pro D again except a putter.
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Re: Plastic preference?

Postby Kscustom » Thu Jul 19, 2012 3:01 pm

I throw ESP nukes and pro d nukes, they will be ok unless you smash a tree very hard off the box but I keep throwing em anyways but it is all about preference and arm speed. For my forehands I use champ firebirds for control and ESP flash for some distance and most folks would not. But that's what works for me not the other guy. If it works and someone tells you it's not right don't listen. Use what you like as far as pros if you are talking good pros with sponcership you are also talking limits ie discraft players can only throw discraft they may like it just fine but think about it like food you wanna only eat pizza or would you rather have pizza Mexican Italian American Chinese Indian Greek most of my friends who are sponcered will tell you mix up your bag until you can't.
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Re: Plastic preference?

Postby ladysmanfelpz » Wed Jul 25, 2012 10:38 am

Ya word. I guess do what works for you. Finding star is gonna be my reliable drivers but I think Im always going to cycle an overstable baseline plastic driver. Dx teerex, firebird and pro d force are sick. Grip is awesome and they fly overstable enough, but nothing like their premium line counterparts. I also find there seems to be turn and wear. Where discs are meant to turn they will in any plastic at the right speed. Wear is the disc beating in and it gets that soft turn way downrange. An overstable in baseline is not meant to turn, but with the right wear will start to develop that turn but it doesn't start til like 200+ ft. Thats how I lost my force. On a whole I can rarely ever reach I bombed it too far past it!! ah well at least its the cheapy plastic and I can pick up another one for not too much $
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Re: Plastic preference?

Postby JR » Wed Jul 25, 2012 12:21 pm

Blake has written a well based attack on what works best for an individual. At least from a perspective of trying to teach multitude of people the basics. Sure there can be short and hopefully long term benefits to getting what works now and shields from user error in the situations one faces on their usual courses and conditions. That does not mean that they'd learn to become a complete disc golfer as fast as possible with instant gratification discs. It is a matter of many topics such as world view, philosophy, proven results of teaching plenty of people etc. whether to recommend long term benefits with data on why the not immediately gratifying result may be better overall. And often is and this is where expert advice differs from less fact based recommendations.

IMO and IME the results vary from person to person based on so many factors on instant gratification or long term benefit that i gauge with my incomplete skills the commitment level and information and intelligence level plus commitment of a player and give advice based on both instant gain and long term better results depending on the person. Some aren't receptive to long term advice and some may be from another person than me. My approach varies person to person because i want them to gain, not everyone other. While i do tailor the responses to a person i also do give long term advice mostly if i'm on a public forum such as this. And i give points supporting the often not obvious long term advice in the hope that the sharper readers would benefit from the deeper analysis than ok this guy won't be able to digest real data so he only believes instant results. (Poor him).
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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