Will this weekend change the face of disc golf?

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Re: Will this weekend change the face of disc golf?

Postby allsport1313 » Sun Dec 16, 2012 3:29 pm

Yeah Will said goodbye to Innova and Discmania on fb I'm pretty sure. Weird wording but yeah
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Postby keltik » Sun Dec 16, 2012 4:42 pm

okay so Will said goodbye to Innova. what else is involved? there has to be something else to this "big weekend."
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Re: Will this weekend change the face of disc golf?

Postby Mixed Bag Madness » Sun Dec 16, 2012 5:43 pm

In retrospect, I wonder if Nikko was referencing this big news here....
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Re: Will this weekend change the face of disc golf?

Postby keltik » Mon Dec 17, 2012 7:40 am

It's Monday now. What happened that changed the face of disc golf?
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Re: Will this weekend change the face of disc golf?

Postby iacas » Mon Dec 17, 2012 8:42 am

keltik wrote:It's Monday now. What happened that changed the face of disc golf?

Zip.

So the answer to the question was/is "no."
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Re: Will this weekend change the face of disc golf?

Postby Mark Ellis » Mon Dec 17, 2012 5:51 pm

iacas wrote:
keltik wrote:It's Monday now. What happened that changed the face of disc golf?

Zip.

So the answer to the question was/is "no."


Just because you can't yet see the ripples does not mean there wasn't a big splash. It will be interesting to see the scorecard from this weekend, how many pros change sponsors.

If the rumors are true and those invited to the new manufacturer are given a month to decide whether to sign or not, do they have enough information to make an informed switch? Did they even get to try out samples of the new molds?

A slew of new manufacturing hopefuls are out or soon to come out. What percent of the new companies will be in business in 5 years? Probably under 10% wouldn't you think?
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Re: Will this weekend change the face of disc golf?

Postby dehaas » Mon Dec 17, 2012 11:36 pm

I think you're more likely to see bag and apparel companies come and go before disc manufacturers. I would imagine that manufacturing discs involves a lot more money invested up front, and those willing to take that plunge are a little more careful since there is more to lose. Printing up shirts or making golf bags by hand at your house is a lot more accessible than injection molding.
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Re: Will this weekend change the face of disc golf?

Postby Mark Ellis » Tue Dec 18, 2012 7:45 am

dehaas wrote:I think you're more likely to see bag and apparel companies come and go before disc manufacturers. I would imagine that manufacturing discs involves a lot more money invested up front, and those willing to take that plunge are a little more careful since there is more to lose. Printing up shirts or making golf bags by hand at your house is a lot more accessible than injection molding.


More retailers will fail because more of them are launched but will the difference be great by PERCENT of failure?. A huge investment usually creates huge ongoing costs, leading to the necessity of huge sales and gaining market share to survive.

The players on this site are knowledgeable and experienced in the game and willing to try the products of a new manufacturer. But most disc golfers just buy whatever their local stores offer. When a golfer hits the internet to buy discs doesn't he mostly buy whatever discs are recommended by his friends? Neither of these tendencies helps a new manufacturer with sales.

What percent of the market is owned by companies other than the big 2? If a MAJOR player stepped in to the market ( Nike, Reebok, Addidas, etc) then it would change everything. There are no indications this has happened yet.
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Re: Will this weekend change the face of disc golf?

Postby Leopard » Tue Dec 18, 2012 8:27 am

Mark Ellis wrote:What percent of the market is owned by companies other than the big 2?

My guess is 80-85% to the 2, informed by processing thousands of orders.

Re: Retailers, I read the original competitive analysis for DN, from 2001. 8/10 of those retailers are no longer around. Some were never on my radar, having started in '05.
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Re: Will this weekend change the face of disc golf?

Postby keltik » Tue Dec 18, 2012 8:34 am

where can one read this original competitive analysis from 2001?
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Re: Will this weekend change the face of disc golf?

Postby tbird888 » Tue Dec 18, 2012 8:34 am

Leopard wrote:
Mark Ellis wrote:What percent of the market is owned by companies other than the big 2?

My guess is 80-85% to the 2, informed by processing thousands of orders.

Re: Retailers, I read the original competitive analysis for DN, from 2001. 8/10 of those retailers are no longer around. Some were never on my radar, having started in '05.

Just out of curiosity, what are the two that still exist? GGGT and DTW?
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Re: Will this weekend change the face of disc golf?

Postby Leopard » Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:32 pm

keltik wrote:where can one read this original competitive analysis from 2001?
start working on your hacker skillz :lol:

tbird888 wrote:Just out of curiosity, what are the two that still exist? GGGT and DTW?
I believe so. Note -- both have strong wholesale operations, including DTW as one of the few Innova wholesalers. Big dealers = retail automation + wholesale.


Not to drift, but you Community guys might consider tipping Justin for what he does; dude must work himself to death. I hope DGCR gets to keep that resource for shopping, but the atmosphere of DG retail forces too many dealers to compete on price and shipping, no matter what their actual value proposal may be. Justin is selling premium service, but he's forced to also lead with price and at-loss shipping. If the continuous posts are true, his service is worth far more than he's charging for it. Retailers without automation work too hard for too little and burn out because they can't charge for service reasonably. He won't set the pricing to do himself any favors, so tip the man for christ's sake.
Last edited by Leopard on Tue Dec 18, 2012 11:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Will this weekend change the face of disc golf?

Postby Steady 26542 » Tue Dec 18, 2012 9:12 pm

Mark Ellis wrote:What percent of the market is owned by companies other than the big 2? If a MAJOR player stepped in to the market ( Nike, Reebok, Addidas, etc) then it would change everything. There are no indications this has happened yet.

tbird888 wrote:Just out of curiosity, what are the two that still exist? GGGT and DTW?

This shows you how I think... I thought you were talking about Discraft and Innova, not GGGT and DTW... :oops:
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Re: Will this weekend change the face of disc golf?

Postby tbird888 » Tue Dec 18, 2012 10:19 pm

Steady 26542 wrote:
Mark Ellis wrote:What percent of the market is owned by companies other than the big 2? If a MAJOR player stepped in to the market ( Nike, Reebok, Addidas, etc) then it would change everything. There are no indications this has happened yet.

tbird888 wrote:Just out of curiosity, what are the two that still exist? GGGT and DTW?

This shows you how I think... I thought you were talking about Discraft and Innova, not GGGT and DTW... :oops:

I believe Mark was talking about Innova and Discraft.
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Re: Will this weekend change the face of disc golf?

Postby keltik » Wed Dec 19, 2012 2:08 pm

http://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/sh ... hp?t=78128

well it looks like Mr. Ellis meant to type Wednesday instead of weekend. Kind of sad when DGCR is my source of "reliable" DG news.
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