Bardu's Bag

[JR]

Those are good discs and you should play all the courses you play on many times with that bag to try to spot holes in the bag. There might not be any on some courses when you throw well and don't need escape shots. Those could prove to be problem with tight short right turns where an understable putter would help. Ions tend to push straight for a long time so a DX Aviar P & A would work or for even shorter and tighter turns the lid shaped Rattler.

[Bardu]

That is some fantastic advice, thanks. Even with the comets and leopard, I'll still want something slow and controllable for get out of trouble shots. I'd been thinking about experimenting with both those discs for while. I tend to like dx plastic, so maybe I should start with trying a aviar p&a?

Either way I'm sticking with this setup for a long time. I've been auditioning discs since I started, but I feel really comfortable with my bag, now.

[JR]

There is another upside to this method it only costs the price of that Aviar

[Bardu]

I've been thinking about adding the p&a. My Ions are getting pretty beat in. I am definitely gonna keep them in the bag but I'm thinking I'll extend their life if I start using something else as my main putter. I have been wanting to try putting with base plastic for a while. Would the p&as make good putters? Otherwise I could just pick up a couple more soft ions. Or I could try bb aviars, felt a jk a few days ago and I think I'd really liked it.

[JR]

More world championships have been won with Aviars than any other putter. Which Aviars is another matter there are so many variations. P & A is a little more fading less gilding more power hungry less blowing by Ion with tackier grip and no bead for easier grip for smaller hands. BB Aviar suits larger hands and fades more. Have you tried Yeti Aviars? With enough use BBs would wear to that shape and it is preferred for putting by many experienced throwers.

[Bardu]

I felt a JK the other day in the store and I have tried KCs before. Is Yeti somewhere between those two? So if I went with BB aviars, would that cover all putt and approach shots? I'm trying to keep the molds down. I'm already familiar with the Ion, that is why I've been sticking with it, but I also like it for putting, approaching, and driving.

[JR]

Yetis are different based on which run they are from and i have not thrown the 4X world putting champion ones. Yetis are tackier and more sunken in in the flight plate than the JK and the bead is smaller. The putting grip is easiest with the Yeti. Any BB Aviar is gonna have a wider turning radius annied than understable putters but with enough angle they can be forced to move right fairly quickly at moderate distances. Yetis are the most understable BBs. I can't promise that any BB would cover all needs but they are good and versatile enough to cover most needs. Understabler discs for quick and short turns to the right and overstable discs for hard left hooks and skips.

[Bardu]

Well, I just suspect I would like a BB Aviar, because it feels alot like an Ion in base plastic. But I am tempted to just say screw it and stick with the Ions premium plastic or no, because I have alot of experience with them. So would the DX Aviar complement the Ions pretty well? Does it hold an anny pretty well? I assume it would be for slower shots? My Ions aren't exactly gonna do a whole lot of spike hyzers for me, they can still cover hyzers, flex shots, hyzer-flips, wind duties, most drives, most approaches, and most putts.

[JR]

All BBs fade more than Ions and DX sure is grippier. When new BBs won't turn super quickly to the right but getting a DX for a way better grip breaks in especially around rocks to turn pretty nicely. I have to say that big bead Aviars are way larger in the hand than Ions and for quick right turns out of the box with good grip and thinner Ion like profile i'd get a DX Aviar Putt and Approach which is a non beaded version. Aviars are better for slower throws than Ions.

[Bardu]

Ok yeah that all makes sense. I am gonna pick up a few ions for backups and continue using them as my main putter, I just love how they fit my hand and plus I have alot of experience with them. No point changing horses midstream. But I'll definately pick up a p&a for utility. I had that same experience with bbs, I had a couple kc pros and they sure couldn't handle as much speed as the ions! I wish I would have given them more of a chance, but I do prefer a softer putter, and even if I went with jks or yetis, I still like how the ion forms to my hand better. The only disadvantage is putting with premium plastic, but I'll live.

[JR]

DX Aviar P&A is surprisingly similar in the hand to the Ion until one thinks that Aviars were Dave Mac's starting point to a Wizard which in turn was the starting point to the design of the Ion so it is evolution of the same and definitely some sort of relations in the shape is left.

[Bardu]

Ok so my bag has evolved a bit, thought I'd post an update. Basically been sticking with the same molds and its been working great. I cut the comets and leo because i found i could cover the same shots with my rocs and eagles. Also, I've rediscovered the Wizard and solved my putter dilemma all in one fell swoop. I will never use another putter again!

165 Champ Eagle X meathook, wind
165 DX Eagle X seasoned main driver

173 KC Pro Roc new
173 KC Pro Roc beat

173 DX Roc new
172 DX Roc seasoned
171 DX Roc beat

172 Eraser Wizard putting
172 Eraser Wizard putting

Ok so basically I feel I need a driving putter. I still have two beat ions that I've used extensively over the last two years, but I really love wizards and feel I should be using the same mold and baseline plastic for all my putter shots. Planning on picking up some softs for this purpose. I have a nice stack of erasers, but I'm assuming these are meant for putting and driving not so much. I also have some backup dx eagles to cycle in.

Thoughts suggestions?

[JR]

Erasers won't survive driving. S Wizard fades less and flips more than HPP. HPP can handle more wind. You have not faced tight tunnels an throwing uphill then if you think that the Eagle can replace the Leo for lasers.

[Bardu]

When I talked to Gateway factory, they said they eventually will be making more mediums, so I was planning on adding mediums and softs at some point. I do think it would be nice to be nice to get all my putter shots from baseline plastic, but I can see where you're coming from, and it could be nice to have just a single hpp as well.

Well the bad news is, I've already traded my pro Leo. I perhaps did not give it enough time to break in to its sweet spot, but at the time I traded it, my seasoned dx eagle was much more controllable on tight spots (for me). Uphills, I didn't think of that, and I may miss it. Just thought I could cover the shots workably while cutting down on molds. I throw eagles much better than any other driver I've tried, Leos included.

[JR]

Pro Leos are much more understable than Champs or Stars so they risk flipping over too much too easily for me at my power and since i like the mild hyzer flip of the C and none of the S i did not try to learn the Pro properly too. Because it is windy here and the flipping is worse with the Pro in the wind meaning more erratic.