newer player building his bag

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newer player building his bag

Postby fireball42 » Thu Apr 04, 2013 12:05 pm

Hello Everyone! this is my first post after lurking here for advice for a few weeks. I have been playing for about 3 months about 3-4 times a month, so I am pretty new still.

somethings you should know. I am left handed but will try and talk RHBH as that is the norm. my GF has started DG with me and atm we share a bag, so i will list the discs that are in there but i do not use.

my bag:

Putter:
Champion Aviar appx 175g
soft magnet 175 (GFs disc. never used it)

Middies:
Champion Panther appx 175g( go to mid)
DX Stingray 172g (use it for turnover shots, and really like its shape and large diamater)
DX Roc 178g (GFs disc. I have practiced with it a few times and really dont like the sharp angled rim)

Drivers
DX Teebird 150g (go to driver that i have been using to learn distance throws and X-step, gotten my best distance and some consistency out of it)
DX Cheetah 150g (GFs disc. never used it)
DX Wraith 176g (got it before i understood that a speed 11 disc is too fast for my level. generally unused)
Star Vulcan 168g (got it with the wraith... pretty much divebombs on me hard after 200ft. way too fast for me)


thoughts on my discs? anything i should add?

also I have been thinking of adding a heavier teebird or similar disc for windy conditions (i live in chicagoland, aka lots of wind) or a speed 6-7 driver with some turnover. Also thinking about adding a speed 8 or 9 driver.

thank you in advance. :D
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Re: newer player building his bag

Postby PMantle » Thu Apr 04, 2013 12:58 pm

fireball42 wrote:thoughts on my discs? anything i should add?

also I have been thinking of adding a heavier teebird or similar disc for windy conditions (i live in chicagoland, aka lots of wind) or a speed 6-7 driver with some turnover. Also thinking about adding a speed 8 or 9 driver.

thank you in advance. :D

So many options. I'll just post a few that I think would work having come through your stage not that long ago.

Wind compliment to Tbird = SL or Orc
6/7 with turnover = Leopard
8/9 drivers. Archangel is really underrated and can be your turnover. I use it for extreme downwind drives, and around the corner turns.

You should also fool around with one or two of Valk/roadrunner/sidewinder. Just depends on you and what you want from that.
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Re: newer player building his bag

Postby bsnone1 » Thu Apr 04, 2013 3:04 pm

I guess I'd be curious to see how far you're throwing what you currently have. If you are getting your teebird out to 300+ IMO, you'd be certainly ready to move up in both weight and in speed on the disc. I also play in a decent amount of wind and I've found that I can't even bring my 150-160g discs out on most days.

I've experimented quite a bit with discs across several brands in the speed 6-9 area. For me, the Millennium OLS and OLF are great complements to one another and add a nice speed 9 disc to the bag. A lot of people like the valk/beast/orc combination - and I would agree that you definitely need something that will fight the wind.

You may also want to look at something for getting out of trouble shots. For me it is something overstable that I can flick or throw overhand TH or thumbers with. I use a Champion Firebird or a super stable 11x champion eagle - but lots of people like the XXX or discrafts flick.

Part of the fun of this game for me is trying new discs. I too bought high speed stuff that today collects dust - but I know some day down the road they may very well be staples in my bag. I have a stack of leopards/eagles/gazelles/teebirds/cyclones/xls/xs at home, and while several are out of my bag, I'm glad I've been able to dig through and find what works for me. Trading on here or facebook has helped purge some of the discs I don't use and stock up on what I love.
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Re: newer player building his bag

Postby bents » Fri Apr 05, 2013 12:06 pm

If I were in your shoes I'd move to heavier driver(s) in more durable plastic, but not to faster molds yet. Unless you play on a really open course and your priorities are distance over accuracy for some reason, your fairway drivers should be fast/far enough.

I've been playing for a couple years, and I can throw about 350 feet, and for me, a distance driver only adds about 20-30 feet, so it isn't worth the inaccuracy.

Heavier discs would be good for two reasons: First because 150g discs are unpredictable in wind. Also because having a huge difference between driver weight and midrange weight makes the aiming/throwing a little different. Light discs will hang onto your fingers a bit longer and go more right (left for lefties). Correcting for this seems like one more unnecessary thing to think about when throwing. You don't need to go all the way to 175g either; my favorite discs are 165-170g.

So here are some fairway drivers that seem to be popular around here: star TL, champion leopard, discmania's FD, Legacy's patriot, Latitude 64's river, MVP's Volt, discraft's XS and XL. If you want an overstable one for hyzers and wind, a champion teebird is my favorite.
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Re: newer player building his bag

Postby fireball42 » Fri Apr 05, 2013 12:59 pm

bsnone1 wrote:I guess I'd be curious to see how far you're throwing what you currently have. If you are getting your teebird out to 300+ IMO, you'd be certainly ready to move up in both weight and in speed on the disc. I also play in a decent amount of wind and I've found that I can't even bring my 150-160g discs out on most days.



I am not really sure how far I can throw other than just estimating from the tee where my disc landed and the basket (i tried a phone range finder but they dont work with such tiny discs). that being said i think i have hit around 300 a few times, but mostly landing my teebird in the 225-275 range (or so i think)

its also nice to know that I am not the only one who bought the shiny super fast discs. I am like gollum and the ring with my vulcan. its so badass.

bents wrote: Unless you play on a really open course and your priorities are distance over accuracy for some reason, your fairway drivers should be fast/far enough.

So here are some fairway drivers that seem to be popular around here: star TL, champion leopard, discmania's FD, Legacy's patriot, Latitude 64's river, MVP's Volt, discraft's XS and XL. If you want an overstable one for hyzers and wind, a champion teebird is my favorite.


great advice Bents. my course generally are not wide open fairways, So I don't need distance necessarily. Is the Champion teebird more overstable than the DX?

are overstable discs generally just better for windy conditions?
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Re: newer player building his bag

Postby PMantle » Fri Apr 05, 2013 2:11 pm

fireball42 wrote:great advice Bents. my course generally are not wide open fairways, So I don't need distance necessarily. Is the Champion teebird more overstable than the DX?


Yes, and by a good bit to me. I found out I don't really care for Ch. Teebirds, but love DXs. I can get them for under $7 at Walmart, so I'll just cycle them. A Star TL is almost an answer to that issue.
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Re: newer player building his bag

Postby bents » Fri Apr 05, 2013 2:23 pm

fireball42 wrote:Is the Champion teebird more overstable than the DX?

are overstable discs generally just better for windy conditions?


Yeah, champion plastic is always a little overstable of star plastic, and star plastic is always very overstable of DX. It's a pretty huge difference... I'm gonna guess that a DX teebird has stability similar to a champion leopard? I don't use either so I might be wrong.

The wind effect on a disc is a little complicated. The thing that determines whether a disc turns, stays flat, or fades is it's speed relative to the air around it. So a 30 mph throw into a 10 mph headwind will turn as if you threw it 40 mph, requiring a more overstable disc. A 30 mph throw with a 10 mph tailwind will turn as if you threw it 20 mph, so an understable disc will work better.

Articles about wind: http://www.discraft.com/res_wind06_p1.html http://www.discgolfreview.com/resources ... wind.shtml
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Re: newer player building his bag

Postby bsnone1 » Fri Apr 05, 2013 8:53 pm

bents wrote:
The wind effect on a disc is a little complicated. The thing that determines whether a disc turns, stays flat, or fades is it's speed relative to the air around it. So a 30 mph throw into a 10 mph headwind will turn as if you threw it 40 mph, requiring a more overstable disc. A 30 mph throw with a 10 mph tailwind will turn as if you threw it 20 mph, so an understable disc will work better.



This makes so much sense - I never had a real sense on wind but this put things into great perspective. I actually purchased two new discs today specifically for wind shots - a champion orc and a star wraith. Ran out to the field in a decent wind - two throws downwind and they both go around 240ft, not happy but hey, I bought them for the wind right? Two throws into the headwind and both discs FLY - easy 300 for both if not deeper. :-D
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Re: newer player building his bag

Postby Qikly » Sat Apr 06, 2013 7:48 am

Just a few quick thoughts from someone who's only been playing a few months longer than yourself:

- If a premium plastic Teebird doesn't handle wind well enough for you, try a DX Banshee. Wind gets pretty serious down here in NOLA, and my Banshee shrugs off all of it. They start out pretty OS, definitely more so than the Teebird, but lose some of that fade while they beat in without losing any wind-fighting ability.

- For a turnover driver, I can't over-recommend a Westside Underworld. I had struggled finding a disc for this slot myself - beat Cyclones and TM Rivers changed too quickly, premium Rivers were more stable than I wanted, and I've never liked how a Leopard feels in my hand. Enter the Underworld: the easiest, most reliable turnover disc I've thrown, and it has fantastic distance potential with its souped up glide. I'd start by trying one in VIP plastic - those are a little bit more versatile and easy to be consistent with than the ones in Tournament. It should pair great with a Teebird as far as covering your lines. Plus, it's a speed 7, so it should be easier for you to work than a Sidewinder/Roadrunner/etc.

- Putters are a personal preference thing, but I would have a hard time using a Champ plastic disc as my putter. I'd want more grip than that. Gateway makes some awesome, grippy plastics, and Vibram's Medium rubber also feels amazing. Coming from the Avair, I'd recommend a Gateway Voodoo or a Vibram Summit.
Banshee|Underworld
Comet
VP|Voodoo

**Currently auditioning Eagle Xs**
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Re: newer player building his bag

Postby JR » Sat Apr 06, 2013 8:37 am

At that point in the career it is better to gain skills than more discs. You should be able to learn to throw each of your current discs left, center and straight and out to different distances. Once that is consistent you have a better idea of possible overlapping and gaps in the bag for all conceivable situations.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: newer player building his bag

Postby bsnone1 » Sat Apr 06, 2013 12:35 pm

The more I read through this thread the more I realize that a heavier teebird, perhaps in star plastic is probably the best idea for your bag.
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Re: newer player building his bag

Postby fireball42 » Sat Apr 06, 2013 2:58 pm

hey guys. i went out to play today in some crazy wind conditions that were gusting 30 mph or more. i had discs falling backwards, hovering, rolling sideways and all kinds of other crazy. it was a good learning experience playing in those kind of experience and overall the day wasn't that bad.

that being said i do think a heavier teebird possibly in champ is in order. i am also spying the XL or a TL too just to try some new plastic.
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Re: newer player building his bag

Postby fireball42 » Sat Apr 06, 2013 4:49 pm



thanks for the articles bent. should be something that improves my game.

JR wrote:At that point in the career it is better to gain skills than more discs. You should be able to learn to throw each of your current discs left, center and straight and out to different distances. Once that is consistent you have a better idea of possible overlapping and gaps in the bag for all conceivable situations.


well i can throw these throws well with my panther and my stingray. being left handed i had to learn to anhy quickly because the courses are generally a little more rhbh friendly. i can also get a decent s-curve with my ray.

i do need to work on these with my teebird, which is newer and i mainly focus on placement and distance.
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Re: newer player building his bag

Postby bsnone1 » Sat Apr 06, 2013 5:02 pm

fireball42 wrote:
that being said i do think a heavier teebird possibly in champ is in order. i am also spying the XL or a TL too just to try some new plastic.


I have an XL in X plastic and I am also a LHBH thrower and found that disc to be nice to throw on holes that require right to left flight - I found it pretty easy to turn over - throw it flat, watch it go left.

I've tried several discs in the speed 6-9 range. You may also want to try the discraft cyclone and XS, and the innova leopard is a nice complement to the teebird. Both the cyclone and the leopard are my "hyzer flip" discs that I can throw decently far for my noodle arm (~300-315 on a hyzer flip)
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Re: newer player building his bag

Postby JR » Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:09 pm

fireball42 wrote:


thanks for the articles bent. should be something that improves my game.

JR wrote:At that point in the career it is better to gain skills than more discs. You should be able to learn to throw each of your current discs left, center and straight and out to different distances. Once that is consistent you have a better idea of possible overlapping and gaps in the bag for all conceivable situations.


well i can throw these throws well with my panther and my stingray. being left handed i had to learn to anhy quickly because the courses are generally a little more rhbh friendly. i can also get a decent s-curve with my ray.

i do need to work on these with my teebird, which is newer and i mainly focus on placement and distance.


That is not gaining you any skills throwing discs that tend to go in any direction. Throwing them straight or in the other direction they naturally go out to different distances teaches you skills and just exactly what those discs are capable of. And how hard it is to bend their flight to your needs. If you find you cannot make a disc do something and nothing else in your bag does the same each time you've found a hole that needs to be filled. It might be a skill or equipment issue. Maybe both but i'm leaning toward skills since you have different good discs. Out of those objectives the one that will lower your scores most is acquiring skills and making you consistent with your new found skills. It is harder to achieve than you might think and surely harder than throwing money at a problem buying everything.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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