Back to Basics

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Back to Basics

Postby mattw » Thu May 02, 2013 8:38 am

So I kind of got swept up in that whole try every new disc that hits the market thing. I ended up just hitting a wall and not getting any better. I learned that it doesnt matter if I am throwing a Saint or an Eagle they both max out at around three hundred feet. I think my real problem is form. My throw looks like a swinging barn door instead of comming accross tight to my chest. So I have decided to disc down to a basic bag. with limited selection of discs. My hope is that I will learn better form with practice in a field get up to at least 350 feet with my Eagles. Any input is appreciated I am also thinking about hitting up a local pro for lessons and some practice drills. He has offered a few times and I think its time to take him up on the offer. I went with an Innova set up becouse I like the way this linup slots together.

Control
3 DX Eagle X 1 Fresh 2 Worn I am working on beating one in and then rotating
2 CH Eagle X For when the breeze picks up and I need something a little more stable than the DX
2 Pro Leopard For tight fairways and anhyzers
2 CH Leopard tunnel shots anything straight all the way to finish

Overstable
1 CH Banshee Windy days and strong hyzer shots

Midrange
3 DX Roc 1 Fresh 1 Worn 1 Beat I missed Rocs forgot how nice they are to throw

Putter
3 KC Pro Aviar 1 Putting only 2 Drives and approaches

The one thing I am questioning is the thought of putting a Gator in the bag. My reason is mostly becouse of a tournament that I played recently and league from last night both had realy strong winds that made it difficult on approach shots. I couldnt get things to hold in tight to the target. I noticed alot of the guys using Drones,Zones and Gators with better results than me using KC Aviars. Is it a bad idea to add another mold to the bag. Once again thanks for any input.
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Re: Back to Basics

Postby PMantle » Thu May 02, 2013 9:03 am

I like the Gator idea. I carry a Sentinal which I think flies similar. It does things none of my other mids or putters can do. Really helps on some approaches and a couple wooded drives.
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Re: Back to Basics

Postby keltik » Thu May 02, 2013 10:49 am

that is a great minimalist setup.

If you want to keep it that way try approaching with a Roc or the Banshee in windy situations.
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Re: Back to Basics

Postby mattw » Thu May 02, 2013 11:32 am

I honestly dont play enough when the weather is bad. So when it does get windy I am not very confident in my throws. Maybe I should get out more during bad weather instead of looking for an easy fix. Its something to think about. Yesterday we had a storm front move in so the wind gust picked up to the 30-40 mph range. Didnt help that at the start of the round it was almost eighty degrees by the end of the round it was fifty.
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Back to Basics

Postby Fightingthetide » Thu May 02, 2013 6:34 pm

I would say you could go without the Champ Leopards if you have a rotation of DX Eagles. They seem like they would overlap. Champ Leo's, especially new, are like mini Eagles. The Pro Leopards will eventually get really flippy, and hopefully at that point your most beat DX Eagle will work well for those shots.

Looks good.

Try a Gator if you want. I use a flat Champ Rhyno for windy approaches under 250'. I had a Gator for a while, but I think an OS putter is more versatile...at least for me. An OS mid is certainly useful, but can be replicated with a disc like a Banshee. You can't replicate an OS putter with a mid unless you aren't worried about over-shooting your target.
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Re: Back to Basics

Postby JR » Thu May 02, 2013 6:44 pm

Since you are absolutely correct in that scoring comes from skills not equipment as much i won't comment on the bag for now. The normal culprits for barn door swinging are not having enough pause and spinning out on the plant step foot. There is lots of advice on both matters and you should search for pause and spinning out/bracing. Basically come in easy to the plant step and don't push with the rear leg and actively move the throwing arm shoulder so that the elbow gets closer to the target than the side of the body with the disc at the right pec. With the body and nose facing 90 degrees away from the target. Only then should the rear leg push and the plant leg should stop moving once the ball of the foot rises up. This bracing of the plant leg is what the rear legs pushes against and once you release the bracing your body turns fast for a snappy finish. Which the elbow led arm movement adds to. The disc and the arm will move a lot faster this way adding instant distance by a significant amount when you get it. Normally this jump is at least 20' but for some nailing it 50' extra feet at your current power level. It is the largest single jump probably in distance in form changing in disc golf if you don't start out with something truly off vs a normal person not knowing what they are doing.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: Back to Basics

Postby mattw » Thu May 02, 2013 7:08 pm

Thank you JR. I read through your post a few times trying to visualize it in my head. I will work on the steps you are talking about in order to improve my form. Its wierd I know that I am doing it wrong but I am having problems getting those thoughts that are in my head to translate into the throw. Thank you for taking the time to give me the breakdown.
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Re: Back to Basics

Postby bents » Thu May 02, 2013 7:40 pm

I was gonna post a thread about this but I though I should just ask an eagle lover directly.

Basically, I don't know why anyone throws eagles when they could throw teebirds. They have about the same net stability, but the difference is that eagles turn more and fade more, right? I thought it was a general rule that straighter (less turn, less fade) leads to more accuracy.

Everyone always says to throw the slowest disc that could reach the target. For example, on an open 250 foot shot, you could throw a valkyrie or a roc (or whatever stable mid and understable driver have the same net stability at that range), but the roc is a way better idea. I can see two reasons for this: 1. the roc will be straighter, and 2. the roc is less likely to overshoot. It seems to me like the straightness of the roc is the main reason.

So shouldn't this logic apply to drivers too? It seems like an eagle thrown a little too high would go farther left than a teebird, and an eagle thrown a little too fast would be more likely to turn into the ground than a teebird, and generally be more sensitive to mistakes. (the way high speed drivers are sensitive to mistakes.)

Anyway I'm not saying you're wrong; you, and all the other eagle lovers here who are better than me at golf, must have reasons, and I want to learn.
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Re: Back to Basics

Postby Fightingthetide » Thu May 02, 2013 7:57 pm

It simply comes down to preference.

Throw either too high, and you are way off target. Throw an OB left in the mix, and you are screwed.

Eagle vs. Teebird is an age-old comparison. Throw whichever you like. They both have their pros and cons. Eagles have less glide but handle wind better. Teebirds have more glide, and handle wind not quite as well. That's only for starters.
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Re: Back to Basics

Postby PMantle » Fri May 03, 2013 7:45 am

Eagles are not sold around here, so I often wondered about this too. Never even seen one I don't think.
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Re: Back to Basics

Postby mattw » Fri May 03, 2013 8:23 am

Fightingthetide I see what you mean about beat in Eagles taking over fairway duties. At this time I do not have any Eagles that are beat in to the point that they are able to pull of some of the shots that I use Leopards for. Once I get some truly beat in Eagles I will give them a chance at all my fairway shots. Thank you for the advice.

JR I spent some time last night going through the throwing motions you talked about. I didnt throw any plastic I just wanted to concentrate on the steps. I noticed that I do not get much body rotation with my old throw its almost all arm. I also found that I keep my elbow very close to my side and not pointed at the target. This also causes my wrist to be set at a wierd angle. I noticed by following the steps my throwing motion felt more tight and compact. It felt like my body was coming through faster and with more power. My older throw always felt weak. Like I never had much behind it. I will continue to work through the steps for a few more days before I start tossing plastic with it. I want it to feel more natural before adding another variable to the process. Thanks again for the help.

As far as Eagles go they felt a little more comfortable to me then Teebirds. I have thrown both and liked Eagles and Teebirds. I decided to pick the one that worked for me the best. I dont think you can go wrong with either one.
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Re: Back to Basics

Postby JR » Sat May 04, 2013 4:13 am

Sounds like your dry runs follow the path most take. The body and legs are much more powerful than the arm.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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