The Judge

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Re: The Judge

Postby BentElbow11 » Sun Mar 30, 2014 11:16 am

Getting the Voodoo out to about 320'. These are SS Voodoos, 172g. Also really like the long anhyzers that pan out nicely at the end. Nice slow sweeping hyzers too. I'm using a full x-step, although slowed down, to drive with them.
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Re: The Judge

Postby UncleBrother2001 » Sun Mar 30, 2014 6:08 pm

I wonder if a Judge could be in the same ballpark as a Voodoo on cleaning up Oat releases? On paper they are pretty similar,but that's on paper
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Re: The Judge

Postby BentElbow11 » Sun Mar 30, 2014 6:28 pm

A Judge should be no problem. Any putter will do as long as it's not one of the few truly understable designs or too light a weight. And avoid lids, they're not aerodynamic.
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Re: The Judge

Postby eg37167 » Mon Mar 31, 2014 9:18 am

SO, question for the Judge throwers.
If I like throwing a Pure, would I like the Judge? Or should I try its beadless version??
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Re: The Judge

Postby PMantle » Mon Mar 31, 2014 9:37 am

eg37167 wrote:SO, question for the Judge throwers.
If I like throwing a Pure, would I like the Judge? Or should I try its beadless version??

I think so. I have used both for approaches recently. Could use either. Pure eventually won, but it was close.

The so called beadless version is a very inaccurate description. The Warden is much closer to a clone of an Aviar P&A than a beadless Judge. It's my putting putter. I do use it for some approaches though.
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Re: The Judge

Postby JR » Mon Mar 31, 2014 10:47 pm

PMantle wrote:
eg37167 wrote:SO, question for the Judge throwers.
If I like throwing a Pure, would I like the Judge? Or should I try its beadless version??

I think so. I have used both for approaches recently. Could use either. Pure eventually won, but it was close.

The so called beadless version is a very inaccurate description. The Warden is much closer to a clone of an Aviar P&A than a beadless Judge. It's my putting putter. I do use it for some approaches though.


nope when driving. The Warden is much thinner than Aviar thus easier to get clean rips out of and it is significsntly more hss and slightly less lss so a noticeably straighter driving putter so mega bueno. Judge is like a thinner kc aviar with less fade.

Warden and Judge are more hss than the Pure and the lss is roughly the same with the Judge and the Pure with the Warden fading less. Glide is in the same ball park with each. They are about as long.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: The Judge

Postby PMantle » Tue Apr 01, 2014 8:11 am

JR wrote:
PMantle wrote:
eg37167 wrote:SO, question for the Judge throwers.
If I like throwing a Pure, would I like the Judge? Or should I try its beadless version??

I think so. I have used both for approaches recently. Could use either. Pure eventually won, but it was close.

The so called beadless version is a very inaccurate description. The Warden is much closer to a clone of an Aviar P&A than a beadless Judge. It's my putting putter. I do use it for some approaches though.


nope when driving. The Warden is much thinner than Aviar thus easier to get clean rips out of and it is significsntly more hss and slightly less lss so a noticeably straighter driving putter so mega bueno. Judge is like a thinner kc aviar with less fade.

Warden and Judge are more hss than the Pure and the lss is roughly the same with the Judge and the Pure with the Warden fading less. Glide is in the same ball park with each. They are about as long.

The Judge is basically a modified Wizard. Rounded nose with bead. The Warden is an Aviar, plain and simple. Just set them side by side. Judges and wardens share no profile similarities at all.

Wizard/Judge/Ion

Image

Judge/Pure just for chits-n-giggles

Image

It's really amazing how much a Pure is shaped like a Zone considering the difference in flights. I have some Harp/Suspect/Sinus pics too.
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Re: The Judge

Postby JR » Tue Apr 01, 2014 10:06 am

Wiz and Aviar are modification apart of not the same theme but the same disc. Wiz designer said he wanted to improve on the Aviar and used it as a base.

It might be just me but my small hands and fingers do not allow for clean rips or the Wizards (plenty it was my main driving and putting putter for some years) and Star P&A 175 flip at full power. Although HPP only a degree or two. Judges with unlean releases flip some and with pure releases not at all. I have gotten some grip locks with the Warden but i blame myself for those and, knocking on wood, they are not that common. Full run up speed full tilt rip with the Warden i don't flip it a single degree. Unless there is headwind. OTOH the Pure cannot handle headwinds either.

To me the Sole and some KC Aviars are close to Wizards and S P2s. Concave top D P2 is the least fading really high HSS putter i have thrown. Too bad they are not that common. I just played a round with Ville Piippo who forehanded one of them maybe 23-25 degrees annied very high probably 33'+ to 290-300' with about 3-4 degrees of getting back to flatter in the end. That is pretty great performance from the disc too. I threw them when they were new last summer and full power BH it was the most forgiving driving putter ever in terms of having insane amounts of HSS. I did not need to worry about form just crushing balls out and they never misbehaved and on the occasion when i had made some mistakes the disc always came back with fairly little lateral movement to the right. The fade was like with KC Aviars of the least fading kind. Or about S P2ish. A totally rad putter that seriously needs to be mass produced. Like lose millions of sales if it is not made are you hearing me Discmania and Innova? These are orange Huk lab stamped ones with an off set small stamp. See them and get them. Maybe send me one as a thank you 8)

BUT the Warden is so good that as a non headwind straight disc it is good too with less fade. So the concave top D P2 probably breaks into Warden flight if it loses some fade when reaching Warden HSS which is 0. Both are bags full of awesome. Those two together yummmmm! Regular P2s are iffy for me because they dislike full tilt rips thanks to being so high that clean releases are hard to get with these mitts. The concave topped one is a no brainer killed to eleven. Woot!
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: The Judge

Postby PMantle » Tue Apr 01, 2014 10:10 am

JR wrote:Wiz and Aviar are modification apart of not the same theme but the same disc. Wiz designer said he wanted to improve on the Aviar and used it as a base.

He must have changed his mind. The design is not even close. Focus is though.
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Re: The Judge

Postby JR » Tue Apr 01, 2014 10:31 am

PMantle wrote:
JR wrote:Wiz and Aviar are modification apart of not the same theme but the same disc. Wiz designer said he wanted to improve on the Aviar and used it as a base.

He must have changed his mind. The design is not even close. Focus is though.


You might want to check out what Dave McCormack wrote of the differences between the Aviar and the Wizrd then. He wrote that he made the Aviar more gyroscopic so there is a thinner center of the flight plate in the Wiz and more thickness toward the rim. Considering the bead he probably was looking at the KC Aviars. The design is close to some Aviars. Grid stamped hard Aviars are not that dissimilar in fligh except lacking the drag of the bead they fly farther. But again i might just be bad at getting Wizards to rip out cleanly. They flip for me and the Warden fades less without flipping at all. Regular P2s flip less than Wizards for me and they are Aviars of some kind too with about the same fade as the Wiz. The differences are small except with concave top P2s and Warden ruling them all with Tangent sharing the top spot as long as it is not cold or wet with Judges, Soles, Focus and the best KC Aviars and regular P2s nipping at their heels. Despite the differences being small they are significant and since people prefere different things i would imagine about everything other than the ultimate performance is already available although unfortunately in limited availability at times. Break in a Ringer or a Breaker and you've got another contender for the top spot. i surprised myself with the Ringer tossing out to 300' without wind on a flat field when new and it has remained as long after the quick and large breaking in. When new the Ringer is the most OS putter i have gotten to 300' and that list is short because it is at the upper end of my power so not that common planning wise even with the longest putters.

I have mentioned so many top putters for drives that all i can say that we as users have a nice situation with so many great options to choose from. Most should have their dream disc or at least close enough for great scores available. Which makes me think of sacrificing a P2 for the sake of science :-) I have not checked Innovastore or anywhere else if they have more of those yummy concave P2s available. Strike now if you see them. Seriously. i will say this on the day after April 1st as well no joke. Really. After a quick thought i am a little hesitant to call it the best disc Innova ever made but it could be. Coming from a Beast lover. Now can you change that name pls it sounded funny? If i had to choose which one of those is better i might not be able to because it is a close race. I'd rather have both and would if concave P2s were regularly available. As in i have none. WANT ONE!!! Or back ups too actually. Throing the first rounds in half a year buying new discs was not a priority for me. Otherwise i might have hunted some down.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: The Judge

Postby PMantle » Tue Apr 01, 2014 10:39 am

JR, place the discs side by side. I am not talking about flight. Neither Judges nor Wizards have a profile even remotely close to an Aviar PnA. Wardens do.
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Re: The Judge

Postby JR » Tue Apr 01, 2014 10:44 am

PMantle wrote:JR, place the discs side by side. I am not talking about flight. Neither Judges nor Wizards have a profile even remotely close to an Aviar PnA. Wardens do.


Yeah i was not commenting the shape at all.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: The Judge

Postby Timko » Tue Apr 01, 2014 3:23 pm

jsun3thousand wrote:Disc golfers are holding the sport back.
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Re: The Judge

Postby UncleBrother2001 » Thu Apr 03, 2014 6:00 pm

I'm finally starting to get how the Judges want to be putted. Took me a while to figure out a Stance that worked with these things.

Earlier I hit a 35 footer and some of my Jumps Putts are nearly going in. It is very true that the classic Blend only gets better when wore in. I think I'm probably gonna use these things even when they are pretty much beat to death,I still bet they will putt good. :D
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Re: The Judge

Postby PMantle » Fri Apr 04, 2014 11:59 am

For such a new disc, it's amazing how many I see in daily play.
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