Innova Tern

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Re: Innova Tern

Postby UncleBrother2001 » Fri Apr 25, 2014 2:59 pm

I don't know what your form is like or anything PMantle,but get something like a Champion Valkyrie and throw it with just a tick of Hyzer or flat. If you have any OAT in your form it will let you know in a heartbeat.Or better yet Get a Comet(EliteX) or Fuse(GL) it will really tell you if your form is off. If I was there with you when you throw a disc I could get you cleaned up in a few rounds. Just remember Be relaxed and smooth with your throws. If you are tensed up and trying to muscle a drive then the discs you are explaining to have understable qualities will do what you say. This is mainly because of OAT and learning bad habits with your throw.

Hey i too sometimes have to relearn my form from the groundup. Like right now actually.I was throwing Terns and Destroyers but to be honest I shouldn't have been throwing them because I was trying to muscle them too much and not be smooth. I went back to throwing Beasts and I am right now getting them over 400ft. this is just because I'm being relaxed and staying smooth.
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Re: Innova Tern

Postby BentElbow11 » Fri Apr 25, 2014 3:26 pm

Well, any driver that has any turn is described by him as an understable POS. If he can't control a Sorcerer, Renegade, or Flow, like he says he can't, I don't think there's any doubt as to what's going on. Of course, it has be the disc's fault, LOL.

The Renegade is a driver I throw, and I think it's a superb driver in the stable-understable category. I hate to see it repeatedly trashed here by a hack who doesn't know what the hell he's talking about. And that goes for all the other drivers he's dumped on because he can't throw them.
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Re: Innova Tern

Postby UncleBrother2001 » Sun Apr 27, 2014 5:28 pm

BentElbow11 wrote:Well, any driver that has any turn is described by him as an understable POS. If he can't control a Sorcerer, Renegade, or Flow, like he says he can't, I don't think there's any doubt as to what's going on. Of course, it has be the disc's fault, LOL.

The Renegade is a driver I throw, and I think it's a superb driver in the stable-understable category. I hate to see it repeatedly trashed here by a hack who doesn't know what the hell he's talking about. And that goes for all the other drivers he's dumped on because he can't throw them.


I still think it's a lot of OAT in his throws as to why the discs behave like they do.

@PMantle. I not trying to tell you what to do or saying you have OAT,but just some friendly advice. If you are turning over the discs you described turning over you might want to look at your form a bit. Nothing wrong with that either,Like I said earlier I'm reworking my form at this moment and I've been playing for 15 years.
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Re: Innova Tern

Postby BentElbow11 » Sun Apr 27, 2014 5:41 pm

So do I, that and poor distance...the 2 usually go together.

Good luck getting him to take that advice. The numbers on the discs are wrong, anybody who disagrees with him is wrong, Westside, DD, and Innova don't know what they're doing, etc, etc.
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Re: Innova Tern

Postby UncleBrother2001 » Sun Apr 27, 2014 5:49 pm

BentElbow11 wrote:So do I, that and poor distance...the 2 usually go together.

Good luck getting him to take that advice. The numbers on the discs are wrong, anybody who disagrees with him is wrong, Westside, DD, and Innova don't know what they're doing, etc, etc.


I feel you man. Some days my distance is good and others they are not. I've got something I'm gonna try though to see if it helps. It's that last step right before you let the disc rip out of you hand. I think my footing is off just a tad. I already texted my buddy about it and I told him I would show him what I meant.
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Re: Innova Tern

Postby BentElbow11 » Sun Apr 27, 2014 5:52 pm

LOL, no, I didn't mean me, I meant I also think he has OAT.

Timing is usually what causes me to be off in driving. That's why it's important to relax and smooth things out(i.e. slow down)
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Re: Innova Tern

Postby UncleBrother2001 » Sun Apr 27, 2014 6:05 pm

BentElbow11 wrote:LOL, no, I didn't mean me, I meant I also think he has OAT.

Timing is usually what causes me to be off in driving. That's why it's important to relax and smooth things out(i.e. slow down)


whoops. I blame the beers. :lol:. The ol lady and my sister are out together and will be gone for a while so I decided to crack open a few.

Yes I agree,when I stay relaxed and stay smooth and I can get some great drives. Sometimes I have to stop myself If I feel I'm getting tensed up. I usually just sit down for a few.
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Re: Innova Tern

Postby BentElbow11 » Sun Apr 27, 2014 8:36 pm

Tensing up comes from thinking too much. I tense up on approach shots at times, and I kick myself for not just pulling through nice and smooth. Blame it on distractions, feeling rushed, a strange behaving and potentially rabid squirrel in my peripheral vision...stuff like that. Then there's tensing up on putts! That I blame on the basket suddenly looking about the size of a hood ornament.

Any individual sport like golf and tennis is more of a mental game than a team sport. You have to perform with no support or help from anyone...you against the world.
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Re: Innova Tern

Postby JR » Mon Apr 28, 2014 1:32 am

Any throw routine should have the planning stage where you decide what to throw and how then clearing the head of thoughts and if tension seems to be a problem yawning inhaling fully then exhaling while dropping down raoised arms as limp as possible then shaking up the arms a bit. If you are not loose after that the chemicals won't help much either probably. To stay calm and free of disruptive thoughts you gotta trust your routine so using familiar discs with familiar shots just like in the Discraft putting confidence clinic helps. So it has got to be you not mind altering chemicals that do the work because you'll pass out from booze etc. in a round if you are jittery and imagine that having some more before each throw is gonna help you get where you need to be mentally. Physcial tension mostly comes from mental tension. A good warm up and post round exercise and stretching should rid you of tight muscles and of course not lifting weights prior to the rounds helps a ton in staying loose muscle wise.
Flat shots need running on the center line of the tee and planting each step on the center line. Anhyzer needs running from rear right to front left with the plant step hitting the ground to the left of the line you're running on. Hyzer is the mirror of that.
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Re: Innova Tern

Postby BentElbow11 » Mon Apr 28, 2014 8:12 am

JR wrote:Any throw routine should have the planning stage where you decide what to throw and how then clearing the head of thoughts and if tension seems to be a problem yawning inhaling fully then exhaling while dropping down raoised arms as limp as possible then shaking up the arms a bit. If you are not loose after that the chemicals won't help much either probably. To stay calm and free of disruptive thoughts you gotta trust your routine so using familiar discs with familiar shots just like in the Discraft putting confidence clinic helps. So it has got to be you not mind altering chemicals that do the work because you'll pass out from booze etc. in a round if you are jittery and imagine that having some more before each throw is gonna help you get where you need to be mentally. Physcial tension mostly comes from mental tension. A good warm up and post round exercise and stretching should rid you of tight muscles and of course not lifting weights prior to the rounds helps a ton in staying loose muscle wise.


I agree with what you're saying...

...and I guess I'll have to stop carrying the flask of whiskey in my bag. :wink:
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Re: Innova Tern

Postby BentElbow11 » Tue Apr 29, 2014 8:37 am

Very interesting...

From a post by PMantle on DGCR:

"I've tried lots of discs. Despite the claims here that I don't have the arm for them, Terns are always my longest discs when I throw on a soccer field or on a course..."

Gee, I wonder why people on DGCR are questioning whether he has the "arm" to throw a Tern? No wonder the Tern is flying overstable for him. And to rationalize not having the arm to throw the Tern, he insists other wide-rimmed drivers like the Sorcerer and Renegade are way more understable than his Tern, while the opposite is true. :roll:
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Re: Innova Tern

Postby UncleBrother2001 » Tue Apr 29, 2014 1:13 pm

BentElbow11 wrote:Very interesting...

From a post by PMantle on DGCR:

"I've tried lots of discs. Despite the claims here that I don't have the arm for them, Terns are always my longest discs when I throw on a soccer field or on a course..."

Gee, I wonder why people on DGCR are questioning whether he has the "arm" to throw a Tern? No wonder the Tern is flying overstable for him. And to rationalize not having the arm to throw the Tern, he insists other wide-rimmed drivers like the Sorcerer and Renegade are way more understable than his Tern, while the opposite is true. :roll:


I just brought the Terns out again yesterday. Still outdriving them or they are the same distance as my Beasts which is around 390ft to 405ft right now. Still don't think it's time to go to higher speed drivers.

I'll still keep the Terns,but for about a year I'm gonna be keeping at it with my Beasts.It seems they are starting to get longer and longer for me.

I could see a Champion Tern flying a bit overstable for him. I don't think I have the arms speed yet for it,but it goes dead nuts straight for me with some fade. It could be my form doing that too. G-Star does these crazy S-Shots and the Star Tern is just understable as heck.
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Re: Innova Tern

Postby BentElbow11 » Tue Apr 29, 2014 3:15 pm

It's a good disc. I remember thinking my 2 early run champ Terns were more stable than the numbers suggested. At the time Innova hadn't assigned -2,2 to champ Terns, but were still going with the original numbers of -4,2...when the champ was the only version being run. They then changed it to -2,2 for the champ. That's spot on, IMO. And it's not overstable whatsoever...but it can be "speed stable" for slower arms. The other plastics are more understable and sound a lot closer to the original -4,2 number. So, you might not be getting the GStar and Star fully up to speed either, but the understability of those is changing the flight from straight w/fade to turning right or S curves. I'm assuming the distance is the same, or very close, and just the flight path is different.

It sounds like you're borderline on the real wide-rimmed stuff, Uncle. At around 400 ft, you're probably on the cusp of reaching the true flight characteristics of these discs. So am I, and it's why I've disc'd down from drivers like the Boss, Havoc, and Bolt. Who needs them when you can get other easier to throw drivers out just as far? Anyway, 400 ft is certainly respectable for a Tern, but if you can throw your champ Beast just as far and straighter, sounds like a plan!
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Re: Innova Tern

Postby UncleBrother2001 » Tue Apr 29, 2014 6:53 pm

BentElbow11 wrote:It's a good disc. I remember thinking my 2 early run champ Terns were more stable than the numbers suggested. At the time Innova hadn't assigned -2,2 to champ Terns, but were still going with the original numbers of -4,2...when the champ was the only version being run. They then changed it to -2,2 for the champ. That's spot on, IMO. And it's not overstable whatsoever...but it can be "speed stable" for slower arms. The other plastics are more understable and sound a lot closer to the original -4,2 number. So, you might not be getting the GStar and Star fully up to speed either, but the understability of those is changing the flight from straight w/fade to turning right or S curves. I'm assuming the distance is the same, or very close, and just the flight path is different.

It sounds like you're borderline on the real wide-rimmed stuff, Uncle. At around 400 ft, you're probably on the cusp of reaching the true flight characteristics of these discs. So am I, and it's why I've disc'd down from drivers like the Boss, Havoc, and Bolt. Who needs them when you can get other easier to throw drivers out just as far? Anyway, 400 ft is certainly respectable for a Tern, but if you can throw your champ Beast just as far and straighter, sounds like a plan!


Yeah the distance is pretty close. I've compared the Star Tern to the Pro Beast and they are usually 10ft apart on this big turnover through the woods at this one course. Now in the woods the damn Star Tern comes flying out of my hand. I mean it is fast. The Beast is not as fast looking but it is usually just 10ft from the Star Tern on Turnovers. Now for Rollers my Star Tern Bombs. I've thrown 420ft+ rollers with it. But I know for sure the G-Star isn't getting up to full speed. It is suppsoed to be a S-Shot type of driver,but it should be a lot farther than what I can do with it.

At the moment the Star and G-Star Beasts are flying like what inbounds has them as. I think it says -38 38. Which makes sense since it does a real nice S-Shot when thrown flat and still has some healthy fade. If I hyzerflip them they go dead straight with a slow fade at the end. Yeah I'm for sure going to be sticking to my Beasts as my Go To Driver of choice. I'm still on the fence about whether or not I want my PD's as my Headwind driver of choice. I like the P-PD's but the S-Line and C-Line I have are really overstable unless I flex them. I don't like flex shots...ever :lol:
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Re: Innova Tern

Postby BentElbow11 » Tue Apr 29, 2014 8:12 pm

Oh, I meant distance being the same between the Terns. You're getting straight w/fade from the champ Tern, an S curve with the Gstar Tern, and a lot of turn out of the Star, but are they all close in distance? That would indicate you're getting the same range out of all 3, but they're all flying differently because of the different stabilities.

How about just throwing the PD for fade and hyzer drives and get something more OS as a dedicated headwind driver. The C-line PD I can imagine is pretty darn OS, it may do the trick as a headwind driver. The S-PD is something I(personally) would use for fade and hyzer drives and leave the straight/turnover duty to the Beast(s).
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