When should a Super Fast Driver be the Disc of Choice?

[Jwt4412]

I have really bought into the slowest disc to reach theory.

But when is the latest and greatest fast disc the disc to actually use?

I play on a course that was put into an existing park with lots of trees.

I never reach for the fast stuff anymore... I think I have bought in too deep.

When to use the big guns? That's the question today.

[Blake_T]

situations to use:

-holes that you can't reach with slower drivers and can reach with faster drivers and there is not a lot of consequence for missing your line.
-holes where a very low trajectory shot (e.g. 5' apex) is necessary or recommended.
-holes where you want a big skip.
-long hyzers where you want a lot of penetration before fading.

[Thatdirtykid]

the fastest disc I throw is the avenger, which dosnt fly like the fastest discs for me, it seems more controlable than wraiths, illusions, flicks, venoms...

However the avenger is one of those fast big gun drivers, and when I throw them is...

...when i want max D on a fairly open hole***
...when its really windy I throw a Z avenger where I may normaly throw a sabre
...when i want to take a very long hyzer route that flys off the fairway (over trees for example.

however the most thrown discs in my bag are my putter (of course, but it gets thrown for alot of midrange stuff too) and my sabres.

***if a hole is very long, or just long with a hard to navigate fairway, I will usually throw a sabre safe, and play two short drives or a short drive and a long upshot instead of going for a less accurate driver for a chance at a 60' "putt", I do this because im pretty much just as accurate from 200-100 feet, so that extra 75-100 feet im getting with the faster driver isnt always worth the risk.

also its important to mention, although discs like a valkarye, xs and other slower not too stable drivers are capable of more distance than orcs and other faster drivers, but are not as consistant, and not as long on golf shots. So Im not a fan of carrying these drivers for max d (although those jk valks and star valks are sooo nice!)

[Thatdirtykid]

situations to use:

-holes that you can't reach with slower drivers and can reach with faster drivers and there is not a lot of consequence for missing your line.
-holes where a very low trajectory shot (e.g. 5' apex) is necessary or recommended.
-holes where you want a big skip.
-long hyzers where you want a lot of penetration before fading.

I geuss I took to long to answer, now it looks like I was just copying blakes answer ....... without wording it as well either

[roadkill]

I would agree with Blake's answer except for the last one (long penetration before fade) for that I still prefer less stable discs just thrown with a little more hyzer. (old style cyclone is good for this)

In addition to the first three situations Blake listed I would add on open holes in high wind conditions.(especially headwind) The faster discs penetrate the wind better and can be thrown lower with less chance of the severe elevator action that can spell disaster with the slower discs.

[Blake_T]

there's a good number of situations where a crush or wraith will outperform a cyclone on a long hyzer line, at least on a more consistent basis. e.g. a 260 knife hyzer you want to pull 45 out to the right and bring it back, this is a MUCH more difficult shot to perform with a clone as it just won't carry without an amount of height that is beyond reasonable for most players.

the wind can vary between discs, but the long penetrating hyzer that fades out late and hard is a shot i usually throw into the wind. however, using a disc like a banshee, viper, x-clone, or xtra, etc. thrown with much less hyzer is also a feasible shot.

[roadkill]

The reason I prefer a cyclone or broken in XL for this shot is I can throw them with a degree of hyzer which remains constant throughout the entire shot. I do it with what would normally be a hyzer flip disc. But with extreme hyzer they instantly flip from say a 60 degree hyzer to a 25 degree hyzer and maintain that angle more or less until they hit the ground 320 or so around the dogleg. I can bend a turnover disc much further left than a stable disc. Seems counterintuitive but if you try it you'll see what I mean.

If I throw a z wildcat, Champ Orc, wraith, avenger or any other high tech disc they will stop flying and dump once the spin slows down.

It's hard to explain in a post but if we were on a course together I could demonstrate it effectively.

[Thatdirtykid]

I would agree with Blake's answer except for the last one (long penetration before fade) for that I still prefer less stable discs just thrown with a little more hyzer. (old style cyclone is good for this)

In addition to the first three situations Blake listed I would add on open holes in high wind conditions.(especially headwind) The faster discs penetrate the wind better and can be thrown lower with less chance of the severe elevator action that can spell disaster with the slower discs.

I think blakes talking about more a long hyzer, I like preds/firebirds for knife hyzers in any range.
I do agree a less stable disc is longer, BUT less consistant if I need to go really long on a hyzer line I will throw a X avenger (fairly understable) and throw it high with a bit of hyzer, let it flip up to a lesser hyzer like you say you do but still get the penetration of the faster distance.

overall I agree less stable is longer but less predictable, and I would still perfer a high speed driver for distance on this line over a slower dirver.

[roadkill]

To each his own.

My old school throwing style and background have a huge impact on my disc and shot selections.

There are very few golfers today that throw the amount of understable plastic I throw.

[Jwt4412]

Thanks for the input.

[Weebl]

Hehe, the flippiest disc(s) in my bag are 2 flat top valks (not very flippy...) a Pro Line Leopard (not very flippy either) and my Champ Starfire (wide open fairway big D or turnovers) In fact, I had my biggest drive ever today with the Starfire. A par 5 with 200' straight with a dogleg left, 450' of more fairway then a dogleg right and 40' into the pin. Right side of fairway is a creek, left side is a steep downward slope to basin 60' down and the fairway is only 10' wide the entire way and very wooded... Wind was in favor so I shot 90 degrees to the left of the fairway into the basin, caught the wind on the high turnover pull and rode all the way to 50' away from the pin on the fairway. Roughly 490' as the bird flies... A great way to end the day with an eagle, the guys I was playing with said they never saw someone actually hit the line going over the basin... wind love... What would you call a 2 on a par 5?...

[Jwt4412]

... anything you want...

[Thatdirtykid]

a par five that should be a par 4...

and for the flippiest disc in my bag a completely beat to hell d cyclone, accually almost too flippy for a roller, but makes an aswome knife anny disc.
I have a sabre almost in that position (once its there the cyclones gone)

[roadkill]

="WeeblWhat would you call a 2 on a par 5?...

Well a 2 on a par 5 would be a double eagle.

However, while I've never played the hole it seems by your description it could just as easily be a par 4. The hole is what, 550' as the crow flies? Unless the fairway is super narrow I'd probably call it a par 4.

At the pro worlds last year there was a hole that went about 320 then hard dogleg left (with mando) through very dense woods for another 380 (700 ' of hole and absolutely no direct route whatsoever) and it was a par 4 (I had a drop in 3 in practice).

[Blake_T]

to further clarify, the hyzers i would throw a fast disc on are shots that are outside of my cyclone range.

examples:
a 340' shot released with 20 degrees of hyzer is a huge throw with a clone if you never want it to flatten (or change angle for that matter). the relative stability of the disc doesn't matter very much to me on these shots, i could easily throw a valk or orion, etc., which i would ahead of a clone but generally stick to discs that are more stable for these types of shots.

a 290' shot released with 75 degrees of hyzer again would be a mega-crush with a cyclone if the shot never changes angle.

i will note that i do not reach for a super fast disc unless i cannot reach it with a slower disc on most shots, with a few exceptions, such as a 220' knife hyzer with a z pred vs. throwing straight with a putter.