sidearm vs. backhand disc Questions

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sidearm vs. backhand disc Questions

Postby soaresjo » Mon May 08, 2006 12:47 pm

Hey guys this is my first post on this sweet forum!
I started playing disc golf last year and have been lovin it ever since. I try and play everyday and have seen myself improve a ton over the last couple months.

That being said I am still only a good beginner. Right now I primarily throw backhand on my drives and have been trying to work on my sidearm.

I have been throwing a teebird, orc, and valk with good success on my backhand. These all seem to be slightly "understable" discs. I can get a good s-curve throwing with an "anhyzer" style throw and a nice line when trying to throw them straight.

I have good power with my drives now and soon might be able to move up to a "faster" disc. The faster speed discs I have been looking at are the teerex, wraith, and surge and have been wondering which of these fast speed discs would best fit by backhand throwing style.

It seems to me that a more "overstable" disc better fits a sidearm throw and a more "understable" disc favors a backhand throw. This might not be the case and quite frankly the terminology is really getting confusing in my head. I was hoping you guys could give me some good advice as to some backhand drivers that I should check out and also some good sidearm drivers for me to practice my technique with.

It seems to me like a lot of discs are classified as "good sidearm discs" however little is written about good backhand discs. Is this because a sidearm drive is superior or just because most discs can be thrown backhand reguardless?

Sorry if my questions have been written poorly but I am new to writing about disc golf. Any responces would be more than appreciated and I thank you for your time.

-john

(I throw a kc roc and pro shark on most close approaches with a kc aviar putter... still looking for that perfect putter. I would like to pick up a wizard)
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new discs

Postby soaresjo » Mon May 08, 2006 2:29 pm

right now I am looking into getting some new discs to try out. I am looking at picking up the following discs:

discraft surge esp
discraft avenger (not sure about plastic type)
discraft buzzz (Z plastic?)
gateway wizard supersoft

just curious if there are any other discs that you guys would recommend.

I am going to be ordering them online and it looks like gottagogottathrow has a good selection/price. I am just worried about the color selection... I want to stay away from a green/yellow color. hopefully that wont be a problem.

-john
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Postby Blake_T » Mon May 08, 2006 2:33 pm

do you know about how far you are throwing?

if you are forced to throw anhyzer to get discs those discs to fly straightish, they are flying overstable for you rather than understable.

i consider the orc to be "high speed," as the wraith is really the only one of those discs you have named that is noticeably faster. unless you are getting the orc to S from a slight hyzer release, you likely are not ready for the faster discs.
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throwing speed

Postby soaresjo » Mon May 08, 2006 2:39 pm

right now I would say an average good drive for me is somewhere in the 350-400 ft range. I can throw an orc real straight it just seems that an "anhyzer" throw is a good way to find your way around obstacles while still keeping good distance.

thanks a lot for your post blake I have enjoyed reading your posts.

On another note I am looking for a disc somewhere between a teebird and a valk and it looks like an avenger would suite that purpose fairly well. Plus it looks to be a little faster than both of those and something I could "grow into". However I have am in the dark as far as discraft plastic goes and I know for instance the X vs Z types fly differently. If I am looking for something between a teebird and valk what type of avenger plastic would you recommend?

thanks again for everything
-john

(the first disc I really liked was the valk and have had a lot of success with it in many different situations. the orc is awesome when I want to really toss it with a lot of spin, have it hold a line, and then fade right. Most recently I have been using a teebird and have loved it. I can throw it real straight and have predict the fade of it wonderfully. All of these will fly well over 300 ft for me)
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sidearm

Postby soaresjo » Mon May 08, 2006 2:44 pm

I would like to develope a good sidearm for obvious reasons. A friend who throws primarily sidearm started on a viking. I currently have a Pro Starfire but I dont think I am able to spin it enough yet. Is there a good beginning sidearm disc you can recommend?
-john
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hyzer shot

Postby soaresjo » Mon May 08, 2006 2:48 pm

from what I have gathered a "hyzer" shot is one where the disc is released at an angle slightly closer to the ground from perpendicular. (sorry for spelling errors) If this is the case and I am throwing backhand I tend to find that the disc will start its turn left sooner and fade to the left a lot. If I were to throw a understable disc with a lot of spin using a hyzer shot it should level out and provide a lot of distance??? I think I will try some of those shots today with my valk.

-john
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Postby Blake_T » Mon May 08, 2006 2:49 pm

the x avenger in 170-172g range fits that bill in between a valk and teebird stability.

however, i would say it's similar speed or even slightly slower than an orc, but also more accurate.

the x is longer than z, and the z is more overstable.

i don't think either are substantially longer than an orc, but it is much more accurate.

i would shy away from the anhyzer and work on flat shots and hyzer flips as they are MUCH more predictable than anhyzers.

as for sidearm, i would recommend working with slow, stable drivers that have predictable fade, but also work on finesse.

the best sidearm throwers are able to throw understable plastic. i learned with putters and condone that technique as it will give you a great amount of finesse for you to add power to.

as for disc recommendations:
dx eagle
dx gazelle
d cyclone

those are very versatile discs, if you are able to throw them sidearm, you will be able to throw nearly any driver sidearm.
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sweet thanks

Postby soaresjo » Tue May 09, 2006 1:42 am

I have really been looking into a gazelle. Looks like a really sweet disc for those mid-long range shots. DX plastic huh, over the champion? Alright I will give that a try thanks. How would you compare the gazelle to the discraft cyclone?

-john

p.s. I understand that different plastics fly differently but I tend to like how the champion plastic breaks in. Unfortunetly I dont have money to keep buying multiples of discs to keep them fresh :cry: .
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Postby TexasOutlaw » Tue May 09, 2006 8:42 am

You want the avenger in x plastic; it is the best out there. I would replace that orc with it.

I don't have enough experience with my esp surge to advice you. It definately turns easier than a wraith, but it doesn't seem to s as good for me. Also, my wraith is longer by far.

The disc I'm most excited about right now is the sirius orion LF. In fact, I'm going to start a thread on it. I haven't thrown it enough to make an opinion yet. But it seems like a more controllable flash to me. It still hasn't surpassed my wraith in distance.

Buzz is one of 2 discs that I carry in z plastic. I carry a d too to putt with in the wind (and to beat up for a right turn mid).
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Re: sweet thanks

Postby presidio hills » Tue May 09, 2006 4:42 pm

soaresjo wrote:p.s. I understand that different plastics fly differently but I tend to like how the champion plastic breaks in. Unfortunetly I dont have money to keep buying multiples of discs to keep them fresh :cry: .


one thing you'll figure out is that a lot of people (blake included, err... leading the way) in the online community will preach DX is better than Champ. people on the course don't read the message boards and get their info from innova's website or eachother or god knows where... they all say "newer is better". "champ is good because it's predictable".
that's all crap. DX is more predictable (less squirrely) than champ. discs beating in is a GOOD thing (after the initial break in they stay similar for a while...). having more than 1 of a mold is a great thing for practifce and this is more affordable with DX.
if your course isn't heavily wooded... i wouldn't hesitate to throw nothing but DX, D etc... and just have everyone on the course ask you "man, why you throwing that old stuff"
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Postby Thatdirtykid » Tue May 09, 2006 5:11 pm

I agree mostly. I like champ/z stuff for my overstable discs. My Z avengers and Z preds are the best overstable plastic ive thrown. Throwing for finesse, control or max D D/DX/X (cant forget S, its great) is the way to go.
Z Pred-ESP Cyclone-Z Force-Z Aftershock-Z Comet-Ion-Pro Rhyno
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