the perfect beginner bag

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the perfect beginner bag

Postby asimo » Tue Jul 26, 2005 11:36 am

Imagine if you will. Your best friend has finally decided to take your advice and start playing disc golf. He is a 6', 230lb, 27 year old male. Initially he goes through a phase of ignoring all your advice and buying tons of discs, just to find out that he has no idea what they do or how to control them. Finally, in a humble moment your friend comes to you and begs for your help. He wants to know what would be the best three or four discs he could use to learn with. You know he has read everything on www.discgolfreview.com about disc selection and is looking for something just a little more specific as far as your personal suggestion of exact disc type, plastic and weight. What will you tell this friend?

Asimo:)

ps Blake, I am also gonna post this exact same thread on the pdga forum so feel free to answer it where ever you see fit.

pps thanks for everyones help
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Postby Blake_T » Tue Jul 26, 2005 11:12 pm

imo:

driver: dx cheeta, dx gazelle, or whamo voyager
weight: 164-167g

midrange: dx shark, dx spider, or d buzz
weight: 168-173g

putter: s wizard, dx aviar, d challenger, or d magnet
weight: 165-175g

goal: be able to execute every possible shot with these discs. by the time they are too broken in it will be time to move up to "bigger" discs anyways.
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Postby Blake_T » Tue Jul 26, 2005 11:12 pm

btw, don't listen to most of the pdga board advice. there was a time when it was good, now it isn't.
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Postby asimo » Tue Jul 26, 2005 11:30 pm

Thanks Blake!!!

I agree about the advice on pdga.com, some of the responses I got were pretty crazy.

Here is what I have in the bag right now...

dx Ace 165g (this seems to finish right and is easily effected by wind)
dx Cheetah 171g (I can usually get this disc to go straight for about 225' and then finish out its last 25' slightly left. If it's windy I may have some problems finishing right.)
dx XD 171g (this disc feels good. I feel like I can put a couple of different types of hyzer throws on it consistently and I have had some minor success throwing it with anhyzer)

I am thinking maybe I should buy a lighter cheetah. I have really liked using the XD for all drive and approach shots(jerry miller's suggestion) but I am open to switching up if that is the right call. One thing I think I might need is a disc that is good with wind, the course I play on is very windy. I would love any other suggestions you have. I am not adverse to buying more discs but I would like to avoid it if possible as I am kinda broke right now. Other discs I have laying around right now include:
Z Talon 172
dx Viking 165
dx Tbird 167
dx Roc 175
Omega SS 172
dx Valkery 167 (very beat)
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Postby Blake_T » Wed Jul 27, 2005 1:29 am

imo, the ace and the cheetah have overlap. i try to avoid redundancy as it reduces shot manipulation development.

i would recommend cheetah/roc/xd out of what you have.

the XD is a fine, under-rated putter. i prefer the classic roc a little more as the XD tends to turn over if thrown > 225' or so. the classic roc will hold stable till closer to 250' (it is a beaded XD).

the z talon is a great head wind disc but may need to be broken in a little bit.

the cheetah, ace, valk, teebird, and viking all make good tailing drivers.

my personal favorite drivers:
z crush
z predator
d cyclone
dx teebird
dx valkyrie
millennium orion
pro orc
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Postby asimo » Wed Jul 27, 2005 11:19 am

Is it ok that the cheetah is 171g? If I was going to buy a disc, which should it be?

Should I stick to using the Cheetah exclusively even in heavy winds? It seems like it will be fine with a tail wind. What do I throw into a headwind? Talon? What do I throw into a fairly heavy crosswind? I'm not sure what to throw when the wind is blowing left to right or right to left.

Is it a good idea to carry both my Ace and Cheetah and throw two drives per hole for extra practice?

respect,
Asimo
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Postby Blake_T » Wed Jul 27, 2005 1:39 pm

imo, if it isn't broken, don't fix it. i don't see a lot of need to replace the cheetah unless it is doing (or not doing) something you want.

you are actually better off learning to throw distance with the cheetah, and then moving on to newer drivers after you have the skills there than using faster discs simply to go a little bit farther and then trying to learn to throw for D later on.

the talon is great into a headwind imo, may be a little overstable depending upon how much arm you have. the cheetah is fine with a tail wind but not stable enough for a headwind.

as for crosswinds, it's about being able to read them. a left to right wind knocks down hyzers and increases the effects of disc turn. a right to left cross wind knocks down anhyzers and makes hyzers fade/skip a lot farther, but also keeps them in the air longer. use this knowledge and select discs based upon what you need.

as for the cheetah and ace, carry as many discs as you want. i've always been of a mind to do my practicing at a field since in a competitive round, you don't get a 2nd drive. more throws is always better for practice though.
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Postby asimo » Wed Jul 27, 2005 3:07 pm

I noticed in the "best of" awards portion of the website that Ace got an honorable mention for best beginner driver while Cheetah did not. Has your opinion changed on these discs or is there something specific about my case that makes a Cheetah more appropriate?
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Postby Blake_T » Thu Jul 28, 2005 10:41 am

best for immediate success = ace.

the cheetah is better than the ace developing knowledge of disc tendencies as it will finish overstable. the ace will give more immediate success. the award was given for a disc that almost anyone can throw straight their first time out.
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Postby asimo » Thu Jul 28, 2005 11:40 am

That makes perfect sense. I don't know how I can repay you for all the great advice. Whether anyone likes it or not(including myself), I just keep having more questions. :lol:

If I go to practice in a feild should I bring all my drivers and throw them in order to get more throws, or should I just take my Cheetah and Ace, or should I just take my Cheetah? What about mid-range discs and putters?

What are the biggest differences (ie.. pros/cons) between the standard reach back and the bent elbow method? Which one would you recommend that I pursue?
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Postby Blake_T » Thu Jul 28, 2005 8:40 pm

just throw every disc, try to spot how they fly different. once you have a feel for that try to adjust your throw so they all fly the same.
rinse, repeat. you have developed a set of disc skills.

standard reach will get you to the plateau faster. i don't really teach bent elbow unless people can't get beyond 360-380'.
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Postby asimo » Thu Jul 28, 2005 10:51 pm

Thanks for all the help!!! I had a couple of amazing drives with my Cheetah today on the course. They seemed much farther than my typical 250'. I think I am finally starting to learn this game the right way. :D
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Postby Blake_T » Fri Jul 29, 2005 12:16 pm

np, glad to hear things are working out.
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Postby asimo » Sat Jul 30, 2005 6:26 pm

Just when I was starting to fall in love with the Cheetah, I lost it. It's got a name and number so I am holding out some hope. :(

The good news is I found a 144g Tbird on my home course with no name or number.

So, I intend on replacing the Cheetah when I get my next pay check but in the meantime should I throw my Ace or my new Tbird? I know that aTbird ranks as slightly more difficult to throw but I thought maybe this one would be a good choice because of it's extremely light wieght.
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Postby Blake_T » Sat Jul 30, 2005 9:39 pm

give it a whirl? hehe

i generally tried to throw nearly everything when i was still in the developmental phase. learning how to read the intricacies and nuances of flight is something that doesn't happen automatically.

while it is good to throw a lot of the "best" discs, there will be certain ones that will fly relatively better for you. i think you can really evaluate your technique using "benchmark" discs but staying open to the idea that other discs may perform slightly better. e.g. you should be able to throw a roc well, but if you can throw a buzz better, no reason to throw the roc. however, if you cannot throw a roc well and need to throw a drone for a midrange disc, the problem is likely in your technique.
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