shooting beside tee

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shooting beside tee

Postby kevind » Fri May 09, 2008 8:39 am

Whats the lowdown on this one. There are a few tees at my home course that have fallen victim to erosion and are sticking up out of the ground about a foot. being some are stupid short and I have fell off the end a time or two I sometimes shoot from the side or behind the tee. Whats the legal stance about shooting from beside/behind the tee.
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Postby tumpsi » Fri May 09, 2008 9:09 am

You can do your run up behind the tee, but the disc has to leave your hand when you're on the tee, I guess it's not defined how much you use the tee, so you could basically shoot behind it, and place your foot over the tee like 1mm or so.
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Postby some call me...tim? » Fri May 09, 2008 9:15 am

The true ruling on it is that both feet have to be in the teeing area at the time of release. Realistically though, especially in casual play, I'd say do whatever feels safest. Safety first, kids. :wink:
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Postby Working Stiff » Fri May 09, 2008 9:22 am

In a tourney a TD will usually designate relief on a really bad tee.
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Postby MDR_3000 » Fri May 09, 2008 9:35 am

You can tee off up to 3 meters behind the line.
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Postby kevind » Fri May 09, 2008 9:40 am

thanks, have been curious for a while now.
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Postby Fritz » Fri May 09, 2008 10:05 am

If the tee pads are a danger, i.e ice, too wet, muddy, erosion etc...You can tee off from the site of the tee box on a safer location up to 3M left or right, or behind the pad.

Applicable Rules:

* 803.05 Obstacles and Relief
* 803.01 General (pay close attention to section C. part (3))
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Postby Fritz » Fri May 09, 2008 10:06 am

Also see the Q&A on PDGA Site:

How does one deal with an unplayable tee?
Response

Applicable Rules:

* 803.05 Obstacles and Relief
* 803.01 General (pay close attention to section C. part (3))

We are assuming that you are referring to situations during a tournament, since you could simply tee from nearby during casual play. First, point out the poor tee during the pre-event players' meeting. Ask the TD/official how it could be played. Request that the tee be repaired or a temporary one set up. If you didn't know ahead of time or forgot to mention it, then simply follow the rule book. Your first option is to play from the tee as is. If an official or the TD is available, you could stand aside and call for a ruling. If both those options seem unworkable, you could invoke the option of "provisional throws" (Section 803.01.C), and play two sets of shots, one set from the messy tee and one set from an alternate tee (as decided by the group). Mark both scores in the margin and seek a ruling from the TD/official after the round.

Rule Question: For example, what if the tee is completely under water (e.g., due to rain)?

According to 803.05.C, you can take relief. You simply back up behind the tee. That would be the nearest lie no closer to the hole and still on the line of play. You can only move up to 5 meters back.

Rule Question: What if the tee is not clearly marked?

Same basic set of options. In the absence of an official, your group will have to decide. Where's the TD? Didn't anybody notice this before the event?

Rule Question: What about tees that are unsafe (such as a wet tee on a downgrade, or one with slippery sand on it)?

Same basic set of options. Where's the TD? Many players improve their stance and safety by putting a small towel down and placing their plant foot on it in order to avoid slipping. Whenever I find sand on a tee pad, I simply brush it off with my towel. If it's really bad you could carry a small whiskbroom in your bag.

Rule Question: What if a tee is in a condition such that in order to try to make the best shot possible one must risk possible injury (such as twisting an ankle because the tee is covered in wet mud)?

Same basic set of options. One might wish to try the safest shot possible (as opposed to the best shot possible) if personal health is at risk. We always choose safety over deuces.

Common sense should come into play. Always play it safe and politely request that the TD either fix it or make a ruling on how to play it. If the situation was not known prior to the round, be sure to report it to the TD immediately following the round, and request that it be remedied.
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Postby MDR_3000 » Fri May 09, 2008 10:27 am

Fritz wrote:If the tee pads are a danger, i.e ice, too wet, muddy, erosion etc...You can tee off from the site of the tee box on a safer location up to 3M left or right, or behind the pad.

Applicable Rules:

* 803.05 Obstacles and Relief
* 803.01 General (pay close attention to section C. part (3))



where does it say left or right of the teepad?
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Postby Fritz » Fri May 09, 2008 10:37 am

MDR_3000 wrote:
Fritz wrote:If the tee pads are a danger, i.e ice, too wet, muddy, erosion etc...You can tee off from the site of the tee box on a safer location up to 3M left or right, or behind the pad.

Applicable Rules:

* 803.05 Obstacles and Relief
* 803.01 General (pay close attention to section C. part (3))



where does it say left or right of the teepad?


I was told by a TD at a tournament this was ok, reading that rule you can only go behind the pad. Interesting... Maybe it was TD's discretion.
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Postby Solbo » Fri May 09, 2008 10:58 am

Definitely TD's discretion.

Otherwise in all other cases, it's 3 meters back from the line, within the parameters of the "box".

My interpretation anyways.
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Postby curt » Fri May 09, 2008 11:11 am

I read this rule quite differently than you guys are. It seems to say quite clearly that you can not tee behind the teebox in this instance. To start with we need to get at the real root of the problem. We are not dealing with an obstacle to a stance. We are talking about a teepad (it sounds like its concrete from the example) which is flat, you can clearly take a stance. Neither mud, ice, nor erosion are on the list of casual obstacles one make take relief from b/c it impedes a stance. The real problem you are having is that these things are impeding your run up. (Would you have a problem if you just stood still and threw?) rule 803.05.C.3 - (3) Casual obstacles to a run-up: The player may move the obstacle provided no part of the obstacle is between the lie and the hole. No other relief is provided.

Therefore, I would say that you can not simply tee from behind the box because you deem it unsafe to tee from on it.


I do have 2 disclaimers to this post though:
1. do whatever you want in casual play, safety is most important
2. the td can tell you to tee off from whereever s/he wants to
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Postby Solbo » Fri May 09, 2008 11:41 am

curt wrote:I read this rule quite differently than you guys are. It seems to say quite clearly that you can not tee behind the teebox in this instance. To start with we need to get at the real root of the problem. We are not dealing with an obstacle to a stance. We are talking about a teepad (it sounds like its concrete from the example) which is flat, you can clearly take a stance. Neither mud, ice, nor erosion are on the list of casual obstacles one make take relief from b/c it impedes a stance. The real problem you are having is that these things are impeding your run up. (Would you have a problem if you just stood still and threw?) rule 803.05.C.3 - (3) Casual obstacles to a run-up: The player may move the obstacle provided no part of the obstacle is between the lie and the hole. No other relief is provided.

Therefore, I would say that you can not simply tee from behind the box because you deem it unsafe to tee from on it.


I do have 2 disclaimers to this post though:
1. do whatever you want in casual play, safety is most important
2. the td can tell you to tee off from whereever s/he wants to


By rule you are allowed to tee 3 meters from the front of the box.

9 feet 9 inches. Do with it what you will. That's the rule.
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Postby MDR_3000 » Fri May 09, 2008 12:12 pm

if its concrete or a fly pad or whatever you don't get the 3 meters...if it's a dirt tee you get 3 meters
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Postby Solbo » Fri May 09, 2008 12:23 pm

MDR_3000 wrote:if its concrete or a fly pad or whatever you don't get the 3 meters...if it's a dirt tee you get 3 meters


Of course you still get the 3m. The 3 meters starts at the front of the tee. So, if the fly pad is only 2 m long I can still tee off from 1 m behind the end of the flypad.

3 m is 3 m, no matter what the tee is made out of.
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